Legitimate Ninjitsu?

[Dazed and Confused]

I saw there was recently a topic on the liklihood of finding a real ninjitsu school, and most people thought it seemed quite unlikely- what do you think of this place?

[Sohan]

Sounds OK to me, though I'm wary of any school that allows students to train with them only once per month while training the other days with dojo DVDs.

I did enjoy this gem:

"We are not spies, stealth assassins, invisible to the naked eye, we do not train underwater or on horse back durning normal dojo sessions."

Hmm. Perhaps they do the above during special sessions?

With respect,

Sohan

[Dazed and Confused]

^^

What does this mean?

the first person in the UK to be graded to a Dan level by both Hatsumi (Bujinkan) and Tanemura (Genbukan).

[bushido_man96]

I think that you would have to take a look at it, to be sure. Of course, who of us has experience with "real" ninjitsu.

Anymore, it has such a bad rap (a la Ashida Kim and others) that I view the terminology "Legitimate Ninjitsu" as an oxymoron.

[shinnekodo]

^^

What does this mean?

the first person in the UK to be graded to a Dan level by both Hatsumi (Bujinkan) and Tanemura (Genbukan).

Hatsumi is the ninja grandmaster that taught Stephen Hayes. He founded the Bujinkan. Hatsumi is the one who received the traditions of the Togakureryu(sp) as the 34th (#?) grandmaster.

To the best of my knowledge, Tanemura was one of Hatsumi's students who broke away and founded the Genbukan.

So, then the above quote would mean the individual in the UK would be the first dan (black belt) in ninjutsu from these traditions. Similar to Stephen Hayes who was one of the first in the US.

[NightOwl]

The likelyhood of finding a place that teaches what ninjas actually did? 0.000000000000000000000000000000000000000001%

The likelyhood of finding a good Budo Taijitsu dojo? In the 80's: 5% Today: maybe 45%. (numbers made up on spot ).

Budo Taijitsu is the only 'Ninja' school that I can think of, it is headed by Dr. Hatsumi in Japan. I've been to a taijitsu dojo before (and have a friend who practiced it for awhile), and from what I saw there(and from some light sparring with my friend), taijitsu has a large emphasis on joint manipulation, soft trapping/grappling, alot of palm strikes, and some basic throws (also some weapons work, they call 'em 'tools'). Basically it is a sub-style of jujitsu; the grandmaster of the art has a backround in many MAs, so I wouldn't be surprised if he incorperated alot of what he knew with a very sparse (if he had any) amount of information on ninja techniques and called it good. Like any MA, it depends on the Dojo and the practitioner as far as SD and combat application goes. I could definately see someone using it effectively, but due to the 'ninja' label, you're going to find more of a "I wanna roleplay as a pajama wearing assassin" kind of crowd drawn to it. Techniques are paracticed slowly with speed increasing as skill level goes up, and eventually I belive that you do get into 'free-form drills'. However there is no sparring, and at least at the place that I know of cross-training is somewhat looked down upon as detrimental to training. There are only three ranks: White, Green, and Black (although I belive that there is a special red belt...any taijitsuka here?), and Gis are black. Definately check it out (there's no harm in looking at all of your options), but be careful as well!

[NightOwl]

Sounds OK to me, though I'm wary of any school that allows students to train with them only once per month while training the other days with dojo DVDs.

if they only train in person once a month, then i'd say look somewhere else. There's no way that you'd be able to get in good practice...Dvd's usually work only if you already know what you are doing and can practice with someone else.

[bushido_man96]

That's some good information there, NightOwl. Thanks for a little bit of clarification on the subject.

[NightOwl]

lol, it's a BIT of a ways away, but if you really gotta train in Budo Taijutsu this would be the place (Airfare not included)

http://taijutsu.com/content/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=87&Itemid=77

The instructors also have experience with Mauy Tai, BJJ, and other MAs. Add the acceptance of cross training with budo taijutsu in actual sparring (instead of opting for the 'too dealdy for sparring' spiel), I'd say this would be an example of the dojos (heck, 16% of MA places in general) that give you a good backround in actual combat and SD.

[Dazed and Confused]

So, then the above quote would mean the individual in the UK would be the first dan (black belt) in ninjutsu from these traditions. Similar to Stephen Hayes who was one of the first in the US.

I've heard of Stephen Hayes, I think he has a chapter in a book I have somewhere. So does this lend at least a measure of respectability to proceedings? And with reference to NightOwl's (excellent ) contribution, do these two forms (Bujinkan and Genbukan?) relate to the taijitsu you refer to?

I'm so very confused! I know all could be revealed by going along but there's no training until the New Year, and so I'd like to gather as much information as I can.

I was concerned by that once a month thing too, but they actually train three times a week plus a MMA/grappling session every other week.

Thanks for all your help everybody,

Cheers,

D+C