Question about all the animal stances.

[bushido_man96]

Just to add to that according the the book Unante there are 14 different versions of Passai / Bassai Kata.

matsumura passai

passai dai

passai sho

bassai dai

bassai sho

tomari passai

i can't think of anything else, actually i am looking at this list ,i can only see 2 main kata Matsumura version and Tomari, i am sure TKD guys have their own version of Bassai too,

I know some TKD schools use bassai dai as one of their forms, but I have never seen it or learned it.

[P.A.L]

Just to add to that according the the book Unante there are 14 different versions of Passai / Bassai Kata.

matsumura passai

passai dai

passai sho

bassai dai

bassai sho

tomari passai

i can't think of anything else, actually i am looking at this list ,i can only see 2 main kata Matsumura version and Tomari, i am sure TKD guys have their own version of Bassai too,

what do they call it?

I know some TKD schools use bassai dai as one of their forms, but I have never seen it or learned it.

[elbows_and_knees]

Most stances are directional - they are about projecting your mass in a given direction, in order to gain a better effect. If I want to drop someone I could use my arm strength, or I could use horse stance in which case my whole body weight is behind the technique.

you don't need stance for that. the term "sitting down on a punch" is used in boxing all the time, and they don't project their mass in a given direction -they stay centered.

Who says you don't need stance for that? Just because the boxers don't do it while punching does not mean that it's right, and certainly when talking about things out of a boxer's remit, such as grappling and throws. And the mass is also centred, there is no off-balancing, the head stays over the hips, it's just that the body mass is dropped. This is particularly useful for westerners who tend to move from the upper body, as it lowers the COG more towards the hara.

EDIT: Also refer to the article linked to above.

obviously you don't NEED it if boxer's don't do it, and if judoka don't do formal stance training. a judoka won't know what a bow stance is if you ask him. I didn't say you CAN'T do it that way, but it's quite obviously not a necessity.

[Jiffy]

The only you NEED in combat is what works at the time. Eg. There is no one thing you NEED, but there are plenty of things that will help!

[bushido_man96]

Just to add to that according the the book Unante there are 14 different versions of Passai / Bassai Kata.

matsumura passai

passai dai

passai sho

bassai dai

bassai sho

tomari passai

i can't think of anything else, actually i am looking at this list ,i can only see 2 main kata Matsumura version and Tomari, i am sure TKD guys have their own version of Bassai too,

what do they call it?

I know some TKD schools use bassai dai as one of their forms, but I have never seen it or learned it.

As far as I know, it is still called Bassai Dai.

[elbows_and_knees]

Just to add to that according the the book Unante there are 14 different versions of Passai / Bassai Kata.

matsumura passai

passai dai

passai sho

bassai dai

bassai sho

tomari passai

i can't think of anything else, actually i am looking at this list ,i can only see 2 main kata Matsumura version and Tomari, i am sure TKD guys have their own version of Bassai too,

what do they call it?

I know some TKD schools use bassai dai as one of their forms, but I have never seen it or learned it.

As far as I know, it is still called Bassai Dai.

Some tsd schools use it too, but the korean styles have a heavy japanese influence anyway, so that doesn't surprise me.

[elbows_and_knees]

The only you NEED in combat is what works at the time. Eg. There is no one thing you NEED, but there are plenty of things that will help!

I agree with that in a sense. I agree with the first part, but as far as the second, I don't actually believe that stance training would benefit a boxer, thai boxer, wrestler, etc. I would argue that it would hinder their progress, at least in the beginning. But that's off topic, so I digress.

[AngelaG]

But the fact remains that a boxer does not grab, grapple or throw!! So dropping their body weight is less of a necessity. I am talking about grabbing an opponent, pulling to hikite and using an arm to drop them The stance would be a big help, rather than relying on strength. This has NO relevance to boxing....

Moreover I am not in competition against other arts. I don't really care what a boxer does or a judoka, but what I am my students do is my concern, and we see what works and what doesn't and learn from that.

[Brandon Fisher]

Sorry for the delay I didn't have internet connection for awhile. Correction on my earlier post there are 16 versions listed. Here is the list from Unante:

1. Matsumura Passai Dai & Sho

2. Tawada Passai

3. Itosu Passai Dai & Sho (probably the most common)

4. Ishime Passai

5. Teruya Passai

6. Matsumora Passai

7. Oyadomari Passai

8. Sekiryu Passai

9. Ichigna Passai

10. Motobu Passai

11. Tomari Passai

12. Kyan Passai

13. Funakoshi Bassai Dai & Sho

14. Chibana Passai

15. Azato Passai

16. Oshiro Passai

[AngelaG]

And that list doesn't include all the groups and dojo that have just not passed on the kata accurately and gradually come up with their own version.