The Real Wing Chun

[wcnavstar]

Wing Chun is a thinking mans art, as such it is meant to be continuously improved upon. Now, this does not mean that a practitioner of the style should attempt to add or subtract theories and concepts or techniques themselves. Nor does it imply a weakness in the stlye itself, thus

necessitating the inclusion of another art to fill in that gap.

No, improvment in Wing Chun comes from continuously trying to futher ones own knowlegde and level of understanding, of the system itself. Too often there are those out there whom reach a decent low level in the system in which the average joe provides them no challenge. Then from there, the progress stagnates, their good, but they will never get any better.

There is a huge difference between those practitioners whom fight with blinding speed, power, and lots of chain punches. To those whom move almost irritatingly slow with perfect timing and control, minus almost any chain punching. Timing and control are two of the most important aspects of Wing Chun. Those whom rely on the speed of their hands along with a

succession of rapid fire chain punches are at a low level, of not just the application of Wing Chun; but, have also a limmited understanding of the real Wing Chun.

[MizuRyu]

I agree completely. Wing Chun is about getting in as fast as possible and finishing the job as fast as possible. It shouldn't take 30 chain punches to knock someone out. It should be quick, decisive, rooted and powerful. I don't fully agree on the stand alone idea however, the traditional system of Wing Chun Kuen doesn't give you much groundwork. It's good to incorporate Jiu-Jitsu (even though I'm sure you've all heard this before). I've found an AWESOME combo in the two in the sense that Wing Chun gives you that tool to close the gap, which can lead to a throw and submission. Or, if you get taken down in the closing of that gap, you'll know how to counter. It's a good balance.

[elbows_and_knees]

As a thinking man, I would say that any style with little to no groundwork could be improved upon in some way.

[wcnavstar]

As a thinking man, I would say that any style with little to no groundwork could be improved upon in some way.

I agree, my post was not meant to be about wether or not wing chun could use some grappling mixed in. It was about the idea of not improving ones own understanding of the system.

Besides most smart wing chun practitioners know how to apply wing chun on the ground which is highly effective; however the problem becomes how many wing chun schools actually train for ground fighting?

You fight how you train, no ground fighting in your training then going to the ground would be bad. Although if you are a wing chun man whom trains among other things to use you wing chun on the graound, then it will be as effective as any other ground fighting system.

But in the end its up to the user not the tools to determine the actual outcome of the engagement.

All of that is off pic from the main concept of this post, if anyone whishes to discuss wing chun's grappling issues. Please start a new post and I will be happy to discuss it further.

[wcnavstar]

one more quick thing, adding in grappling or throws ect... is not part of improving the style. (Wing Chun is a complete art.) It is all part of improving the indavidual practitioner.

[Traditional-Fist]

one more quick thing, adding in grappling or throws ect... is not part of improving the style. (Wing Chun is a complete art.) It is all part of improving the indavidual practitioner.

It is more of a complete art than many people give it credit for, because there IS grappling and ground fighting in Wing Chun. Not in most lineages it seems, but at least in a few including the one practiced by me.

Anyway, as you said this is not the topic in this thread. I agree with you and the other poster. Wing Chun's aim is to finish the conflict as quickly as possible. If ones opponent is still standing after one connects with him with three direct hits then either one is studying the wrong kind of Wing Chun or he is studying the right kind but is still at a lower level.

[elbows_and_knees]

If ones opponent is still standing after one connects with him with three direct hits then either one is studying the wrong kind of Wing Chun or he is studying the right kind but is still at a lower level.

that's way too broad of an assumption to make.

[pocketcoffee]

Not only is it a generalisation, it more or less doesn't need to be said. Re-phrasing him slightly you get, if you can't beat the other guy, you're either not very good or your training isn't very good. Isn't this obvious? And let me guess, if that guy is doing the wrong kind of wing chun, then yours must be the correct kind of wing chun? Can I ask what kind of wing chun yours is, why it is better than the rest and where can I go to learn your wing chun?

[MizuRyu]

There is no 'correct' form of ANY martial art for one. It's what works for who's using it. Some would go into the roots of wing chun and the system origins and blah blah, but what it comes down to is what works in a fight and what doesn't work in a fight. Let us also keep in mind that a good 70% of the strikes of Wing Chun (most lineages) are directed to the throat, knees, groin and eyes, hence the lack of 'sparring' in nearly all of the systems, and I say sparring in the sense of TSD or Karate. The bottom line of the WC is it seeks to exploit the obvious weaknesses of the human design and crumple them in the shortest time possible though a series of concepts developed to fit that purpose. It feeds on the fact that your opponent may very well be much larger than you and possess a greater fighting skill than you do, and to treat every opponent as your equal or superior and fight him on that same assumption.

[elbows_and_knees]

that lack of sparring can possibly hurt more than it helps...