2 year black belts?

[tkdman102088]

I want to know why so many people in martial arts are recieving black belts after two years. i believe that at a black belt level you obtain experience and skill that can in no way be obtained in two years even with 12 hours of practice a day. present your argument in a professional manner please.

IN NO WAY DO I WANT TO OFFEND PEOPLE WITH THIS TOPIC>>>THANK YOU>

[MartialArthur]

Why not?

How long do you think it should take?

My school takes a minimum of 2.5 years but 3 years is more typical. Some people on here have argued that it should take 10 years minimum. Of course it depends on the art, the instructor, the individual, and the frquency of training.

I think this argument will be as easy to settle as arguing what is the best color. I like blue.

..

[tkdman102088]

well i believe it should take from 5 to seven years to achive first dan. and yes this will be hard to settle because everyones view on the issue is different. i just want people to express their views on the issue and talk about it. theres no real answer to this issue and there will never be. just leave your point of view.

[Kill Jill]

In Korea, a 2nd dan is obtained upon 2 yrs of training. That's 5 x 1 hr per week. Korean gyms promote on basis of time rather than actual ability. At first I found this unacceptable, but there is at least a set timeframe in which a target can be reached - an important motivator to keep students coming back for more. Also, because most TKD students are at the age of prime fitness levels, some of them can actually make a large progress in a relatively short space of time - unlike myself! I turned down a Korean gym instructors request for me to schedule a date for my 2nd dan test, and have in fact found the instructors now take less interest in helping me develop my skills. They just don't get why I would want to wait.

I think it may be possible to achieve a 2nd dan rank within 2 yrs if you study intensively, although personally I prefer to wait until I feel 'ready' for belt promotion. Moreover, I would like there to be more of a uniform grading system to stipulate exactly what someone of a 2nd dan rank should be expected to be able to do. It seems gyms have such wide varying testing techniques, what might be a 2nd dan rank in one gym might not be a 2nd dan rank in another gym.

However, there's also the 'wisdom' side of martial arts that also should be taken into account. Original martial arts was about philosophy of understanding your art. I think it still applies today, that only across time, can you understand more fully about the true meaning of 'do' in TKd.

Actually proving your skills to be worthy of your rank is more important than proving through the number of stripes on your belt.

[Aodhan]

well i believe it should take from 5 to seven years to achive first dan. and yes this will be hard to settle because everyones view on the issue is different. i just want people to express their views on the issue and talk about it. theres no real answer to this issue and there will never be. just leave your point of view.

And, it's been beaten to death in several threads already. However, it all goes back to the basic question: What makes a black belt?

Forms? I could teach a receptive student all the forms needed inside of 6 months.

Sparring? I can teach someone a competent level of sparring in 3-6 months.

"Street" fighting? Again, 3-6 months to achieve a level of self defense that would be sufficient against 90% of attackers.

Weapons? Why would you need them? Unless you are in the habit of carrying an escrima stick around you pretty much won't have them in a fight.

Ok, so lets look at hours. How many hours to get to a black belt level? That's going to be different for everyone. You give me a natural athlete, with 1.5 hours a day, 5 days a week I could get him to a competent black belt level in 8-12 months.

Also, you need to look at how much someone trains. Take someone that comes in for classes 4 times a week at 1.5 hrs per class, and practices another 10 at home. 16 hours per week x 52 weeks x 2 years is 1664 hours. Is that enough? Should it be more? Less?

It all comes down to the individual, how much they train, and how athletically inclined they are. Some are more than ready after 2 years, some won't be ready for 10.

Black belt is a state of mind as much as it is a physical capability, and any time frame is purely arbitrary. It's up to the instructor to make the determination and promote according to who is ready.

Aodhan

[aefibird]

Plus, if people have prior experience in training then it will help. I've been training in TKD for about a year now and I'll have my blackbelt probably after about 18 months of training. However, I also have a blackbelt in Karate and have trained extensively in other martial arts as well. Yes, if I said "I got my blackbelt in 18 months" many people would jump on me like a ton of bricks and claim that I was 'given' my belt or that I must train at a McDojo because I earned it in such a short space of time.

Time scales are different for different people. It may take a person as little as 2 years to go from complete beginner to blackbelt. It may take another person in the same class 5 years or more. Each individual is different and, to me, there is no "optimum" time length.

[frightmaster]

I am in the process of training for my BB test in TFD. I have been studying for 3 years now and feel I am ready. I may not know what theythrow at me for my test. I do have the confidence to attempt anything they give me. Will I make a mistake? Yes. As all have as well under pressure. What does it take to obtain a BB, in my opinion it is a mind set that comes with a persons indivual training that prepares them to apply what they have learned. Not an amount of time it takes them or the quanity of moves they know.

With this said I have trained 3 days a week in class for about 5 hours total plus about 10 at home. I am dedicated to my art as well as I can be in a professional life of work and family. I should have tested sooner but my school is waiting for others to reach the testing point mentally so there will be more then just 1 person to test. Is this fair to me? Not my place to say it. It does make me that much more ready to advance.

[tkdman102088]

great points people...although for some reason i cannot fathom attaining the mindset of what a black belt is supposed to have in 3 years. i.e having chi power, being cool in times of danger, and formost of all of these a blackbelt should be able to teach or mentor a student. teaching is not for everyone but everyone who is a blacbelt should be competent enough to teach anyone regardless of learning curves or disabilities without becoming angered or stressed. i hope this makes sense.

[Sohan]

For point of comparison, I got my MBA in Entrepreneurship and Marketing from Georgia State University in 1 year (2001). It's normally a 2 year program, but I kicked it up a notch and made it in Jan-Dec 2001. I got my other Masters of Science in Exercise Science over the course of 2 1/2 years (1993-1996).

Even though it's only been 5 years since I last graduated, I feel I have retained far more of my MS than the MBA (I had straight A's and B's in both programs). I use both degrees for my business, but I am convinced I have lost more of what I learned in the MBA than I have in my MS.

The point being, if I had stretched my school out over 2 years instead of 1, I likely would have absorbed more of the material and made it a part of me, plus I would have understood the relevance of what I had learned more thoroughly.

Respectfully,

Sohan

[bushido_man96]

I don't see anything wrong with 2 year black belts. If the person can demonstrate knowledge of the forms, one-steps, self-defense techniques, and other requirements of the system, then why not?

Lets play devil's advocate. Let's say that you enter into a non-ranking fighting system, like boxing. Now, if you practice for two years, should you be able to go fight? Because if you do, then you are going to gain some recognition; moreso if you win. Then people will begin to recognize you as having some skill and ability.

Is this any different than what a black belt in 2 years gains?

Let me know what youall think.