a bad name for martial arts.

[UseoForce]

very true

[Son Goku the monkeyking]

but u also have to take in the fact that MA teaches u how to defend with ur whole body and to take items and use them as weapons, and to kill( not knock out, KILL) with one move or a sertain technique, aswell as instint knockouts when hitting someone at a sertain pressure point, & bone breaking techniques, organ rupturing moves, and how to break bricks, wood, or take exstreme pressure to the body through intense mental toughness.

and people still think that martial arts is crap

i dont know about u but if i can git into a fight situation, and end it very quckly with one or two simple techniques, i rether do that than have to keep hitting and hitting an opponent over and over again before he falls witch could take and unimaginable, amount of time and effort, plus dippending own how strong the attacker is could mke u alot more fatigue before u .

or wat if ur in a self defence situation where some1 is tryin 2 kidnapp u.

most attackers will sneek up own u from the behind or an angle were u cant punch them unless there really cocky and ignorrent.like by putting u in a choke hold or bear hug, this is not a one on one fighting cenario ( i cant spell) were u are both facing each other h ehas already got u in a area or situation were u as a boxer have never trained for now wat do u do.

were as the martial artist who knows many differnet techniques from pressure points to bone breaking to killing can easly no how to get out.

dont get me wrong i am not trying to dissrepesct boxing i am just tryin to say my oppinion on its methods.

PEACE

[bushido_man96]

I don't know about that, Son Goku. Let a boxer thump on you a couple or times, and I bet the fight will end quick. About 7 years ago, I had an old man who was a dairy farmer, and a little better than 60 years old, decide he wanted to take TKD with us on Saturdays. I can remember sparring with him, and busting him in the jaw with my fist. The guys head didn't even move. I apologize to him for the contact, and looked at me funny. Even at that age, he was probably the toughest SOB I had ever met. He was a professional welterweight in the 40's and 50's, I think. He was also one of the nicest guys I ever met.

I think that one of the problems with the boxing/MA arguement is that is easy to catch a boxing match on TV. The MA fights are a little harder to come by, unless you watch a UFC or something. With the popularity of things like UFC and K1, this is changing. But so is the image that the public sees of the martial arts. These guys don't mention forms, or internal training, or talk about their "Master Instructors." They just look like guys who train like boxers, but spread out their time to practice kicking and grappling as well.

[ebff]

A friend of mine was a boxer (he had trained for a bit) and he wanted me to show him some wing chun (yes I know, it's very bad to teach people stuff out of the kwoon, leave me alone, I paid £15 per class for the stuff) so I tried teaching him some basic sticky hands stuff and he ended up stopping after 2-3 tries saying he "wasn't used to being hit during training". Now the guy trained as a boxer, which makes me think that boxing's "tough" reputation is perhaps undeserved. However I'm sure proper boxers are incredibly tough, and when they went in they knew what to expect - being pummeled in the head until KO as opposed to flying acrobatics.

[cross]

I have recently ended my training in traditional karate and started boxing training, so i think i can relate to what your talking about.

Here are my views on the subject:

take items and use them as weapons, and to kill( not knock out, KILL) with one move or a sertain technique, aswell as instint knockouts when hitting someone at a sertain pressure point, & bone breaking techniques, organ rupturing moves, and how to break bricks, wood, or take exstreme pressure to the body through intense mental toughness.

Your correct, martial arts can teach all those things, but how many people who train martial arts 1 or 2 times a week can actually do all of this? probably no-one, certainly not anyone who is attending high school(which is what your talking about).

On the other hand, a person who trains in boxing for even a short time learns how to hit hard, and stop other people from hitting them. (which is a near essential skill in a self defence situation).

i dont know about u but if i can git into a fight situation, and end it very quckly with one or two simple techniques, i rether do that than have to keep hitting and hitting an opponent over and over again before he falls witch could take and unimaginable, amount of time and effort, plus dippending own how strong the attacker is could mke u alot more fatigue before u .

Self defence is not like a boxing match. Boxers can end fights with 1 or 2 techniques quiet easily, it just depends on the skill of the person your facing.

You also mention fatigue... For a boxer, who generally trains to keep fighting round after round, fatigue would not really be an issue.

I guess we can talk about it all we want, and people will have good arguments for both sides. But to answer your original question about why boxing gets so much respect...

The best way to find out is to go to a boxing gym and give it a try(which is what i did, and now i train exculsively in boxing), it might be an eye opener. You'll see what real conditioning is all about, and what works and doesnt when it comes down to it.

[elbows_and_knees]

but u also have to take in the fact that MA teaches u how to defend with ur whole body and to take items and use them as weapons, and to kill( not knock out, KILL) with one move or a sertain technique, aswell as instint knockouts when hitting someone at a sertain pressure point, & bone breaking techniques, organ rupturing moves, and how to break bricks, wood, or take exstreme pressure to the body through intense mental toughness.

and people still think that martial arts is crap

cuz a lot of it is. You have to take into account a few things about boxing as well as fighting in general also:

1. killing and KOing with one technique is VERY unlikely. It is what you strive to be able to do, but will rarely, if ever do.

2. boxing has the same capability. people have been killed from a straight punch to the heart - just a lucky punch with enough force in the right spot at the right time.

3. boxers use more than just punches. They clinch, and there is also "dirty boxing". freddie roach - one of tyson's former trainers - stated the following, alluding to dirty boxing: "If a good hook misses, the elbow lands".

4. What do you think a good hook punch to the jaw produces? A KO. shots to the liver do the same thing. So, you can say that boxers aim for pressure points as well.

i dont know about u but if i can git into a fight situation, and end it very quckly with one or two simple techniques, i rether do that than have to keep hitting and hitting an opponent over and over again before he falls witch could take and unimaginable, amount of time and effort, plus dippending own how strong the attacker is could mke u alot more fatigue before u .

this is where you misunderstand both boxing and fighting.

1. in fighting, you can't always end the altercation in one or two strikes. 98% of the time, you will NOT.

2. boxers are doing what? FIGHTING OTHER SKILLED BOXERS. It takes them a while to KO another skilled fighter. On the other hand, they would KO anyone if kesser skill - like in a streetfight - quite quickly. When you are sparring people of equal or greater skill than you, how long does it take you to beat them? think about it...

or wat if ur in a self defence situation where some1 is tryin 2 kidnapp u.

most attackers will sneek up own u from the behind or an angle were u cant punch them unless there really cocky and ignorrent.like by putting u in a choke hold or bear hug, this is not a one on one fighting cenario ( i cant spell) were u are both facing each other h ehas already got u in a area or situation were u as a boxer have never trained for now wat do u do.

dirty box - use elbows and headbutts. And no, most attackers don't do that - it all depends on the situation.

were as the martial artist who knows many differnet techniques from pressure points to bone breaking to killing can easly no how to get out.

pressure point fighting is WAY overrated. and elbows can break bones. so can headbutts.

[elbows_and_knees]

A friend of mine was a boxer (he had trained for a bit) and he wanted me to show him some wing chun (yes I know, it's very bad to teach people stuff out of the kwoon, leave me alone, I paid £15 per class for the stuff) so I tried teaching him some basic sticky hands stuff and he ended up stopping after 2-3 tries saying he "wasn't used to being hit during training". Now the guy trained as a boxer, which makes me think that boxing's "tough" reputation is perhaps undeserved. However I'm sure proper boxers are incredibly tough, and when they went in they knew what to expect - being pummeled in the head until KO as opposed to flying acrobatics.

he either had not trained long or had a horrible coach. no boxer worth his salt would ever be unaccustomed to being hit. even guys that aren't training to compete spar. Since you told your story though...

I was sparring a kung fu guy once. I told him that throat and groin techniques were legal. He was unable to hit me in either place. Many of those small targets you focus on are very hard to hit if your opponent doesn't want you to hit them and has any amount of training.

[elbows_and_knees]

I think that one of the problems with the boxing/MA arguement is that is easy to catch a boxing match on TV. The MA fights are a little harder to come by, unless you watch a UFC or something. With the popularity of things like UFC and K1, this is changing. But so is the image that the public sees of the martial arts. These guys don't mention forms, or internal training, or talk about their "Master Instructors." They just look like guys who train like boxers, but spread out their time to practice kicking and grappling as well.

I don't think this will change how the world view traditional ma. It opens people's eyes to wrestling, boxing, muay thai and bjj... none of these are traditional. Very few guys in mma now admit to even having any traditional training. There are really only a small handful.

[Son Goku the monkeyking]

I have recently ended my training in traditional karate and started boxing training, so i think i can relate to what your talking about.

Here are my views on the subject:

take items and use them as weapons, and to kill( not knock out, KILL) with one move or a sertain technique, aswell as instint knockouts when hitting someone at a sertain pressure point, & bone breaking techniques, organ rupturing moves, and how to break bricks, wood, or take exstreme pressure to the body through intense mental toughness.

Your correct, martial arts can teach all those things, but how many people who train martial arts 1 or 2 times a week can actually do all of this? probably no-one, certainly not anyone who is attending high school(which is what your talking about).

On the other hand, a person who trains in boxing for even a short time learns how to hit hard, and stop other people from hitting them. (which is a near essential skill in a self defence situation).

i dont know about u but if i can git into a fight situation, and end it very quckly with one or two simple techniques, i rether do that than have to keep hitting and hitting an opponent over and over again before he falls witch could take and unimaginable, amount of time and effort, plus dippending own how strong the attacker is could mke u alot more fatigue before u .

Self defence is not like a boxing match. Boxers can end fights with 1 or 2 techniques quiet easily, it just depends on the skill of the person your facing.

You also mention fatigue... For a boxer, who generally trains to keep fighting round after round, fatigue would not really be an issue.

I guess we can talk about it all we want, and people will have good arguments for both sides. But to answer your original question about why boxing gets so much respect...

The best way to find out is to go to a boxing gym and give it a try(which is what i did, and now i train exculsively in boxing), it might be an eye opener. You'll see what real conditioning is all about, and what works and doesnt when it comes down to it.

Okay about the part were u said that it would be very hard for someone to learn to use weapons, and break bones etc. because the average MA person only trains few times a week.

that may be true to some, but the same can be true to a boxer if that person dose not train much in there gym it would probly have the same affect as to someone who only trains in a MA a dojo only a little. the techniques u know ( including, the weapons and breaking and pressure point etc.) depend own how much u train and practice in the Dojo/ boxing gym, and at home

if a person only practice there techniques when they are at the dojo than of course there not going to be very good. the same can be said if a boxer only practices his moves at the gym 1-2 times a week. he probly wont be very good. many things factor in to a persons fighting abillites. it also depends how well the teachers are nomatter how much u train poor teaching will still equal poor self-defence abillites.

u cant just make an ussomption ( a-sump-tion-- man, i cant spell 2 save my life) like that without looking at the whole picture first.

PEACE

[jaymac]

I think for the most part, people training in whatever style is going to get out of it what they give to it. Boxing is a wonderful sport. I enjoy watching matches on t.v. I love traditional martial arts. I would love to be able to watch a program teaching about martial arts. Every know and then you see one on Discovery or TLC or something and it is always informative and interesting. However, these programs are far and few. Now with MMA on Spike t.v. it takes martial arts to a different level of brutality than boxing. So again, not a great name for MA, even though I enjoy watching that also. Then you turn on some of these sport channels to see The Disney world MA competition where people are doing gymastic and acrobatic martial arts moves that would not be effective in any type of realistic fight. All in all, boxing is true to what it is. I think that in itself attracts people to the sport.