Guys giving in to ladies??

[Kasumi27]

I wanna hear from you guys out there.

heres the thing, when you guys spar or practice with us girls, do you only use like say 50 to 80% of your strength??

cause i hear from most of my friends in karate that guys hit "less hard" as compared to sparing against guys.

I'm in aikido and it doesn't really matter whether they resist or not.

don't get me wrong, i'm not putting you guys down.

i also understand that its only "gentlemenly" to let the ladies "do whatever they want"...

pls comment on what you guys think......

[Orion]

I can't speak from proper sparring experience, however I don't think I would ever use 100% of my strength against anyone when sparring. However I would use different amounts against different opponents

[marie curie]

Yeh, in my clubs, the guys use about 80% of what they use on other guys, so they say. They say its not something they do on purpose, but that it's just strange to hit hard.

[Nick_sam]

i went to a karate class on tuesday. this was the first one i had ever been to, although i do have experience in aikido. towards the end of the session the white belts were told to do some free sparring against the black. i happened to be opposite a girl (black belt) who couldnt have been more than about 14 or 15, myself being 22 and a good head and shoulders higher than her. even tho i dont doubt for a second she could hold her own against me (as i have no striking experience for starters!!) i found myself unable to properly strike her. its merely out of principle, which is totally understandable. even when in aikido the sensei demonstrates a move on me i cannot do anything full force, be it a punch, chop, grab, etc, because he is definately in his 70's or above. he is 8th dan and strong but one has a sense of principles ingrained into them from an early age and striking a girl or an elderly person just seems wrong.

this is nothing to do with underestimating the other person, its to do with how you are bought up to act towards others. yes a dojo is a different story, but the conventional etiquette is still there.

[Ottman]

I'm with Orion. Different degrees of hardness for different people. However, this has nothing to do with the sex of the person. I generally adjust to hit my opponents with the same amount of force as they hit me. But if some girl started hitting me hard, I would hit her hard back, just as I would do with a guy. Of course I always maintain control over my strikes.

It also has a lot to do with the amount of confidence I feel my opponent is sparring with. If I feel like they're comfortable and focused with their fighting, I'll hit them a little harder to test that focus. If they're struggling to work their footwork, and hesitating to strike, and generally unsure of their strategy and what to do, I'll let up and try and to create opportunities for the opponent to get a clean, scoring strike in order to give them some confidence and momentum. Again this has nothing to do with sex, (or age, or rank either.)

For example: there is a green belt in TKD at my MA school who is 15 and female. Regardless, she is almost as tall as me (I'm 5'8") and although I probably have around 20 - 25 pounds on her (I'm 190lbs), she is a tough girl, especially for a 15 year old. She has proven to have great focus, and is very dedicated to training, so she spars like a black belt in her age group. When we spar in class she hits me hard, and I know she's trying to test her own skill, and wouldn't want me to let up on her and strike lightly, so I don't. I hit her with about 80% of my real power, which is all I'll allow myself to strike with in a training situation, so she gets my full force as far as training goes.

There are only about three other people in my school who I will spar with at that level, and they all happen to be adult males who are red belt and above, but the point is, the criteria for sparring using such force is based on many more factors than just sex in my opinion.

Conversely, their are many guys, of all ranks and ages, that I will not spar hard with, because I don't feel they could handle it, and therefore it would not help them train. My goal is to challenge people on the training floor, not overwhelm them.

When it comes to BJJ, the same rules apply, but we don't have any girls in our class so I can't make the same comparison there.

[Treebranch]

I'm with Orion. Different degrees of hardness for different people. However, this has nothing to do with the sex of the person. I generally adjust to hit my opponents with the same amount of force as they hit me. But if some girl started hitting me hard, I would hit her hard back, just as I would do with a guy. Of course I always maintain control over my strikes.

It also has a lot to do with the amount of confidence I feel my opponent is sparring with. If I feel like they're comfortable and focused with their fighting, I'll hit them a little harder to test that focus. If they're struggling to work their footwork, and hesitating to strike, and generally unsure of their strategy and what to do, I'll let up and try and to create opportunities for the opponent to get a clean, scoring strike in order to give them some confidence and momentum. Again this has nothing to do with sex, (or age, or rank either.)

For example: there is a green belt in TKD at my MA school who is 15 and female. Regardless, she is almost as tall as me (I'm 5'8") and although I probably have around 20 - 25 pounds on her (I'm 190lbs), she is a tough girl, especially for a 15 year old. She has proven to have great focus, and is very dedicated to training, so she spars like a black belt in her age group. When we spar in class she hits me hard, and I know she's trying to test her own skill, and wouldn't want me to let up on her and strike lightly, so I don't. I hit her with about 80% of my real power, which is all I'll allow myself to strike with in a training situation, so she gets my full force as far as training goes.

There are only about three other people in my school who I will spar with at that level, and they all happen to be adult males who are red belt and above, but the point is, the criteria for sparring using such force is based on many more factors than just sex in my opinion.

Conversely, their are many guys, of all ranks and ages, that I will not spar hard with, because I don't feel they could handle it, and therefore it would not help them train. My goal is to challenge people on the training floor, not overwhelm them.

When it comes to BJJ, the same rules apply, but we don't have any girls in our class so I can't make the same comparison there.

There's a green belt in BJJ? Anyway, I think it's stupid to train full force. There's no need for it. I cannot tell you how scary it is to train with over zealous people. I've had to let some guys out of locks, because they would have hurt themselves by moving without thinking, then I and up getting hurt for being nice to them. In a real situation I'd destroy these types. There head is not in the fight, they just want to win. Win what? I want to learn. Training is learning and learning should be fun.

[UseoForce]

I have a hard time sparring (grappling or stand-up) with anyone significantly smaller than me. Its hard to judge how much force and effort you should use, and the smaller person often fights either scared, or like he or she has something to prove.

It's tough.

[Spirit At Choice]

A girl's perspective:

I have a lot of softies in my white belt class. We use large padded targets for kicking, but I don't feel comfortable using full force on many of the younger kids (we are a 12 and up group) because many of them just REFUSE to try to take it (won't use a strong stance, are prepped to flee before I even raise my knee, complain or say "ow" if I knock them back a step or two.)

We had a new guy in class, about my age (36), and we were practicing blocks. When I'd block his punch he'd rub his wrists and say things like, "Gosh, you can really feel that..." I haven't seen him since.

It's hard to know whether or not to think, "Hey, I should be sensitive to these softies," or to think, "If they can't take tiny knocks, they're doomed anyway."

In any event, I've learned to ASK my partner how they feel. If given the option some of the teenie-bopper girls will be firm about NOT wanting me to kick hard enough to make them step back from the impact, or NOT being willing to take a bruise in blocking exercises.

And I feel very comfortable telling men to go full out, and assure them I will tap out, or verbalize if I'm being hurt excessively.

[Kasumi27]

looks like guys have more to think about when sparring with the ladies. I kind of understand the principles thing. Cause in training, i have to keep telling the big guys to grab harder. Maybe they're just being sensitive, or opponent.

What i'm trying to put through is that they lose focus when they have a girl teaching them, especially the adult trainees, people who join after 20.

I'm 19 and most people say i look older. So whats with the sexist thing.

If i do a technique and try and be "nice", they think you're not effective, if you get rough, they think you're over serious. Ironic isn't it??

So normally when i teach, I teach with full force.

[Kasumi27]

One more thing

When I was doing my grading for shodan, I had a surprise request for 3 big guys to grab onto me. It was hell to have 3 big guys grabing on; one on the waist; and another 2 grabing each hand. I couldn't even move!!!

I guess if they wished to pin me down, they would have no problem doing so. So I did appreciate that they "let loose" a little. Otherwise, I would be immobilised by those three big guys.

I guess the point is that we all react to the situation and circumstances right?? I've once been grabbed by two guys who put their weight down onto my hand, my hand was kindda bruised, I guess theres a big strength difference between guys and girls huh...

One thing good about guys is that they have all the energy they need, whereas girls only have limited strength.

But guys tend to get a little more hasty and wanna end things quickly (I guess they're impatient), whereas the ladies take their time to execute the technique.

I'm also conscious that guys have this "cannot lose face" theory, or what you all call pride or honour. But isn't this a hinderance to training if you're a "cannot lose" kinda guy??

I thought guys were not supposed to be so petty over such trivial stuff.

Guys out there pls comment.