Shotokan

[ps1]

If you guys who have trained in shotokan for a long time could do it all over again, would you do the same or would you have branched out to keep learning and what would you have switched to?

No. It's not so much because it was shotokan, but that it was Karate in general. It lays a great foundation on which to build. I've sparred with boxers who comment on how hard I can punch. In MAA classes they are amazed by my ability to utilize elbows, knees and kicks so effectively. The shotokan I studies, while not complete on its own, was instrumental in much of the skill I have attained. It's not the individual techniques, it's the broader concepts of timing, distance, biomechanics, zanshin, and more.

You fight as you train. I decided after joining the military that I was no longer training for point sparring. It's that simple.

[24fightingchickens]

If you guys who have trained in shotokan for a long time could do it all over again, would you do the same or would you have branched out to keep learning and what would you have switched to?

I would take up Goju-Ryu instead if I could go back in time and if some really good Goju was nearby.

[Killer Miller]

I would definately do JKA again. I am an athlete in other sports, also a perfectionist so-to-speak, and I liked karate for the art of perfection. My goal was never self defense - although this would be a by-product of it. The exact mechanics of JKA Shotokan was the most structured I had seen. It helped my other sports tremendously.

I think it is an awesome and well supported art for what it is. It also provides a basic mechanics foundation that is very rare to find and obtain elseware. Could JKA delve into other realtime applications? Sure. But that's not really what the JKA is all about.

Yes I'm happy with what I learned and would definately do it again. Does this mean I get a second life to do it all over again?

- Killer -

[bushido_man96]

Not that I can offer much on the Shotokan side of this thread, I have been involved in two different TKD organizations, and I have enjoyed my time in both. One was the ATA, and the other is currently the TTA.

The problem that I have run into, however, is that I think the GM of my current system is very narrow-minded. Likewise, my current instructor is kind of the same way. He makes a good case about having a strong base in an art, like TKD, or like the JKA would be for most of the readers here, but doesn't like the idea of cross-training very much. I do know of one of the GM's former students that broke away from him, taking a big chunk of the students with him. This student had one of the organization's biggest schools, and to put it bluntly, he took a hit in the pocket.

The school I go to is also very curriculum based. We do basics, then forms, then one-steps, and some sparring. My instructor is a very good technician, and is a good teacher. However, I don't feel like we get enough self-defense practice in, and I know that my training is suffering for it. Unfortunately, I don't have anywhere else to go around here, so I do what I can with what I have, and try to expand my knowledge in any way possible.

The best thing to come out of all of this is that if I ever were to run my own school, I would know how I would want to do it and what I would try to concentrate on for the students.

[karateone]

I am a 3rd Dan in Shotokan. It would definatly work onthe street. i know from first hand experieces. If I could do it all over again, I definatly would. I love the defense part and in my school we teach alot of bunki and self-defense. My instructor is a cop and alot of the people in the dojo are cops. between their training and ours we try to get the best defense systems available.

[bushido_man96]

I am a 3rd Dan in Shotokan. It would definatly work onthe street. i know from first hand experieces. If I could do it all over again, I definatly would. I love the defense part and in my school we teach alot of bunki and self-defense. My instructor is a cop and alot of the people in the dojo are cops. between their training and ours we try to get the best defense systems available.

This is the kind of training that I am longing for.

[Jiffy]

That's a really great thing to hear, Jiffy. How do they like it as a whole? Does there seem to be a high retention rate?

Not really. While people have commented that it's the one thing they love the most, it hasn't really meant that we get more students. Partly because new students wouldn't know the difference. It's only at a higher level they start to appreciate it.

[bushido_man96]

Don't get me wromg, I do not regret my training in Shotokan. I do wish though, at some point, maybe the 4-5 year mark or so that practical applications were introduced. By now they would be firmly implanted.

I feel exactly the same way about my TKD training at this point, too. My school has a heavy emphasis on technique, basics, forms, and one-steps, and some sport sparring (but not enough). Basically, all we spend time on is the testing material.

I like to get the most out of the time invested, in whatever I do. Now after 10 years of training I feel that I'm lacking from a practical self defense perspective, for no real good reason.

Once again, I have been feeling the same way for some time. I have been spending a lot of time thinking about how I would do things if I ran my own school again.

I have started to explore the applications in the katas and have been slowly incorporating them during kumite. I will continue to refine and strengthen the "Shotokan cannon", use it where it makes sense and use the kata applications where they make sense.

I recently picked up a book that focuses on the applications of the system of forms that I practice. I am looking to start practicing them with whomever I can get to partner with me.

From a positive perspective, this has renewed my interest in training immensely and provided a new layer of technique to explore for years to come.

I agree with this point as well. Just thinking about the applications of techniques, and practicing what I need to for my work scenarios helps to keep me motivated. I do not want to be unprepared.

[juey palancu]

It's sad to hear long-time shotokanists so disillussioned with what they are getting from shotokan. It's also sad to say that after traveling for a while and training with JKA dojos in different places, I have found out that some well-known dojos are really shortchanging their students by preparing them to compete in tournaments but not to survive in the street. The JKA nowadays may be really doing a disservice to Shotokan!

Kata is the essence of karate and the Bunkai is the connection between the kata and the real world. I was fortunate to learn in a Shotokan dojo (actually, it was the sensei's backyard) in which the hardcore students have been going for YEARS, they are true apprentices and the sensei (a 6th dan) is a true teacher, very generous with his knowledge, and his instruction includes a LOT of Bunkai. Because of this, we have become quite adept at applications and self-defense, including grappling and joint manipulation. Students from our group are generally feared in inter-dojo 'friendly' competitions in our area, which include goju, shorin, wado-ryu, and shito-ryu clubs. Our knowledge of bunkai and our effectivity is usually better than the other clubs, and we get many 'take it easy, please' requests in our inter-dojo meetings, evne though the other dojos, specially the goju-ryu ones, usually include younger, larger, more athletic people. We are a tough group I have to say! And we are Shotokan!

My point is, it depends on the dojo, the teacher, and the purpose of the dojo, not the style/art itself. Anybody who says Sensei Funakoshi was not a bunkai-oriented guy does not know a lot about the history of karate. He was actually FAMOUS among senseis of his time for his knowledge of bunkai and application of technique.

The post-Funakoshi, post-Tanaka, JKA needs to get it together, though, because it seems they might lose their connection with the true essence of karate.

two-cents,

Gero

[juey palancu]

BTW, 24fightingchickens, GREAT WEBSITE!!!! Your articles are really good. Are U a professional writer?

Gero