Losing Rank/Being Demoted

[ivette_green]

If a Blue belt can mop the floor with a Black belt, does the color matter anymore?

Then I wouldn't call them a black belt, I'd call them a faker!

[MasterH]

I spoke to an ITF master recently who told me he busted one of his BB's down to white belt after the students returned after a 10 year absence. So, I guess it can be done.

Yea, if I had a certificate with their signature on it saying that I have earned a Dan rank......I would have issues with that.

-Adam

[MasterH]

Is it rank? "I'm gonna bust you down to private soldier!"

Or is it a certification?

You can loose rank, if you accept that it is not skill based, but pecking order based. Otherwise, they can't take away your skill. That's like taking an exam and passing, then 2 years later getting a letter saying "Sorry, changed are mind, we're taking your pass back"

Great question (statement)

I would say color belts and recommended (probationary) black belts are rank. Dan is certification.

-Adam

[shogeri]

It is a traditional sign of respect, put forth by the student, to go back as a white belt after a long absence.

Some take it away based upon a drastic unexpected change in the moral, ethical, or legal behavior or actions of the the student.

This is rare, but can happen.

In my system, the rank exists for the instructor first, student second.

However, since they did earn it, I will instead take away the ability to certify other's within the system if such happens.

A form of disassociation if you will.

[IcemanSK]

I spoke to an ITF master recently who told me he busted one of his BB's down to white belt after the students returned after a 10 year absence. So, I guess it can be done.

Yea, if I had a certificate with their signature on it saying that I have earned a Dan rank......I would have issues with that.

-Adam

Yeah, I thought it was odd, too.

[MasterH]

It is a traditional sign of respect, put forth by the student, to go back as a white belt after a long absence.

Some take it away based upon a drastic unexpected change in the moral, ethical, or legal behavior or actions of the the student.

This is rare, but can happen.

In my system, the rank exists for the instructor first, student second.

However, since they did earn it, I will instead take away the ability to certify other's within the system if such happens.

A form of disassociation if you will.

Interesting. I know of a few people that would have effected.

-Adam

[gojupralgo]

We don't completely remove a rank, but they may be bumoed down a bit.

For example, a Shodan, might get a white stripe on the belt, temporarily holding the rank as Shodan-ho. An interim rank. That interim rank can be removed at discretion. It usually doesn't last very long.

Other ranks may get the white stripe as well. It's just used iuntil they get back into shape. It also may be used when someone comes from another DOJO. It depends on where the student had studied before in the same style, and how good they seem to be. Ranks from other styles are not accepted.

[IcemanSK]

My best friend was in a similiar rank situation I am, only worse. He trained under the guy that gave us bogus ITF certificates from day one. When he went to a school to resume training (w/ his kids now) he offered to be busted down to white belt. They said, "No, you're a 2nd Dan black belt. You earned." I would have never thought to do that.

He's been there almost a year. At some point, he'll test for 3rd under these new folks.

[DKizzle]

Our school, as far as I know, doesn't require you to do anything to keep your rank, but if you leave for a long time you are required to attend a certain number of lower rank classes (though you can still wear your old belt).

And we have had students demoted or Brown Belts made to wear a White/Yellow/Orange Belt for a couple weeks.

[Eric_]

Well, my instructor has threatened to demote within colored belt rank if you forget your material. Also, a brown belt student, who was very close to testing for black belt, has returned after a very long absence, and the instructor is making him retest for his brown belt curriculum before he can proceed to his black belt test.