Karate defence against BJJ

[24fightingchickens]

One of the problems with the UFC and any training situation where a friendly wrestler takes on his karate buddy is the difference in experience.

There is experience, and then there is training experience, and they are two different things.

Karate players train at training. They do not actually fight anyone in their classes - they spar - which is pretending to fight. They do not actually break people's bones or poke out their eyes. When finally confronted with someone to fight for real, it might be the first time a karate player has ever been in a fight, and it isn't surprising they get their hats handed to them.

Wrestlers, on the other hand, actually do their method of fighting when they compete. They use everything they have pretty much the way they would use it on someone in a self defense situation. Karate players do not.

So, wrestlers, I believe, build up experience, while karate players build up training. Karate players become professionals at practicing karate, not professionals at *doing* karate.

So, when I see these guys fight each other, I'm not surprised. The BJJ guy goes in knowing what it will feel like. The karate guy stands there wondering what it is like to actually put his fist into someone's face, wondering if he has the guts, etc.

And in friendly competitions, of course the wrestler has the advantage. The floors are padded, not concrete slab, and the karate player cannot actually do anything that will stop the wrestler cold. The wrestler is pretty much free to ignore pulled punches and still take the guy out. Even UFC hobbles the karate players by putting them on a squishy mat and padding their fists. That's pretty much the fight right there.

But comparing martial arts is pretty much pointless - again - there are so many variances betwen people and their abilities and things left up to chance that you never know what will happen.

I like these experiences, and I am also not surprised that the big cheeses of the karate world avoid them like the plague - because they are humiliating.

[lgm]

Be sure your fighting stance is low, knees bent . Try to evade being held by the legs. But, if he does catches your legs, use gedan empi (downward elbow strike) to hit the back of his neck before or when he makes contact to free yourself. If you are able to evade being held by the legs, step back and execute a strong mae geri (front kick) to any part of his face and then use your elbow for a follow-up downward strike.

If you are fighting a skilled grappler, this will not work. Not unless you got a lot of luck on your side and he is very sloppy...

If you want to stop leg shoots you have to learn how to sprawl, no way around that. No other solution will work, and even with that you will still get taken down.

If you are serious about learning to stay on your feet find a wrestling club.

But as you are taking karate, I'm just guessing that MMA fighting is not your main priority, so why is this one particular threat such a problem?

Pitting a skilled grappler against a skilled striker/kicker cannot be predicted accurately as to who will win. Extraneous variables are simply too many to control in order to predict reliably. Hypothetically however, IMO, if the latter can deal a knockout blow or paralyzing strike first before the grappler who is not skilled in mid-range fighting can get a firm hold on the former, he will win. Otherwise, failing to dominate prior to being grappled, the striker/kicker with no grappling skill would likely lose.

Gene

[pineapple]

I agree with previous posts that the way to learn to defend against a grappling art is to learn the art.

I had many years of training in traditional karate prior to training in BJJ and I found that it was nearly impossible to prevent from being taken to the ground by an experienced grappler.

[JimmyNewton]

chuck liddel is the champ and he rarely goes to the ground with anyone. watch his fights and see how how he handles them

[pineapple]

chuck liddel is the champ and he rarely goes to the ground with anyone. watch his fights and see how how he handles them

Chuck Liddel is both a wrestler and BJJ practitioner so he knows how to defend against a takedown.

[b3n]

All good posts.

[White Warlock]

What you are suggesting would take years of BJJ training.

Ill ask instead: Is there anything i can do, given my limited karate-only training, that would help handle a BJJer? Or am i simply screwed?

I'm not going to torture you by repeating what i stated earlier.

The error of most 'standup' fighters, when dealing with grapplers (and this is especially notable in the early UFC-type competitions), is that they 'wait' to get physical. They are in their element, and thus should immediately get busy and take over with a barrage of assaults. No sparring, no single-shots here and there, no taking turns, just full-on brutality.

Seriously, that's what grapplers do. When they are in their element, they don't just sit there... they get busy. That is one of the reasons non-grapplers feel overwhelmed when they get on the ground... because they ARE being overwhelmed. It's a non-stop series of assaults on your limbs, face, torso, etc.

So there it is. Use what you know... but actually use it, don't just hold back for that one-punch miracle and definitely don't spar. Against a grappler, you 'own' range fighting, so take ownership... and own your opponent.

Granted, this is far easier said than done, but it 'can' and 'should' be done.

So, when I see these guys fight each other, I'm not surprised. The BJJ guy goes in knowing what it will feel like. The karate guy stands there wondering what it is like to actually put his fist into someone's face, wondering if he has the guts, etc.

Well, the initial poster practices kyokushinkai, a form of karate that emphasizes actually exposing themselves regularly to applying what they know. Although their competitions have been toned down since the early days, with rules about no face hitting and such, there is still plenty of "knowing" what it is like to actually put their fist into someone. Therefore, i don't believe this is the obstacle here. They have the conditioning.

[feels]

In mixed martial arts, BJJ is mandatory. No question about it. Then again, pure BJJ fighters don't survive in MMA either. Everyone needs to cross train for MMA, nowadays. Especially, karatekas.

On another note: In a real situation, your opponent would turn your groin into hamburger meat if you rely on the guard.

[y2_sub]

chuck liddel is the champ and he rarely goes to the ground with anyone. watch his fights and see how how he handles them

Chuck Liddel is both a wrestler and BJJ practitioner so he knows how to defend against a takedown.

Liddel is a great grappler , therefore he know how to defend takedowns

[y2_sub]

like that old chestnut of 90% of fights ending up on the ground

Thank god that isnt true.

Nope, and in fact the reality is nowhere near that.

That's where you are wrong AngelaG , it may not be 90% , but the fact of the matter is : most of the fights end on the ground or in a clinch , even in a pure striking environment like in boxing , Thai/kick boxing the fight ends in a clinch which may lead to a takedown , in kyokushin fighters grab each other all the times , if a pure striker ends up in clinching/garbbing a grappler then he will find himself on the ground