Oom Yung Doe- What's the deal with it

[Steve_K]

Scottnshelly

The supposed oom yung do cult would basically fit all of those descriptions, especially the first, with perhaps a little less emphasis on religion. Extremist? Most would agree. False? Possibly. A charismatic leader? Check.

This is not necessarily my belief, but the reflection of several persons' accounts.

If you have until black belt training oomyungdoeperson, then you should be fine for a while, and just be careful.

[White Warlock]

Here is a previous discussion we had on it, inclusive of links i provided:

http://www.karateforums.com/viewtopic.php?t=21689

Initial poster, what you need to pay attention to is whether you feel at all 'manipulated,' paying more than the 'standard' fees (when compared to other ma schools), pushing for you to spend more money on 'extra' equipment or training, signed a long-term contract, etc. One thing you might want to find out is why those other students left... involuntarily. Was it because they were asked to provide too much money in order to continue their studies, or was there something even more ... ugly?

The history of this art you are studying is false, and therefore what you are receiving cannot help but be 'unhealthy,' despite your having a good feeling now.

As to comparisons of other arts, i'll be blunt about this. TKD has one of the worst problems out there right now with substandard instruction. There are supposedly some good instructors teaching it very well (allegedly from the ITF), but i have yet to meet one. As to choosing an art, i can tell you right now, OYD is not a very good one. It may look good, but its applicability in a real life situation is so so. I recommend continuing to read articles and discussions here in this forum to obtain insight into various concepts you may find 'missing' in that system, as well as pick up some useful knowledge and gain an understanding of what 'other' systems can provide for you. I'm a 25+ year veteran of the arts, and there are many others here with plenty of experience that are willing to share.

Something you mentioned about your instructor... him not liking to repeat things. Well, frankly, if he's an instructor that should not be an issue for him, so i'm somewhat unnerved by that. It sounds to me like you have an 'impatient' instructor, which is a sign he may not respect his students. I don't train under people i don't respect and part of the requirement for that is whether they respect me and others. Something to consider.

Obviously the choice is yours to continue studying this system or of finding another system to study... one that has a healthy foundation.

[oomyungdoeperson]

Hey's not really impatient, he just expects us to pay attention the first time... I'm not certain as to what other schools are within the area but there is a Black Dragon Kung Fu school somewhere... I believe I will do a little more research into other martial arts, but if you could provide me with an unbiased reference source I would appreciate it very much. Also, has anyone found any websites other then the three main ones and links coming off of them as evidence? I can't seem to find any.

As of yet, I haven't bought equipment other than a uniform top and bottom, and I don't know what you mean by long term, but i had a choice between 3, 6, and 11 months, so I took the eleven month course. It amounted to a sum of $900, but I don't know how that compares with other schools.

I do feel my instructor respects us, as if we don't want to get hit he won't hit us.

[dbrillha]

I am hesitant to try Tae Kwon Doe, as some of my peers in Oom Yung Doe (lower belts) have had experience with it, and say it lacked certain aspects that Oom Yung Doe had... I believe the example often stated is TKD kicks from the ground, wheras the majority of OYD kicks start from picking up the knee first, allowing a variety of diffirent kicks from that position.

I'd really doubt an instructor who said TKD doesn't chamber it's kicks. It's not like chambering kicks is unique to Oom Yung Doe - many styles do this.

I'd like to point out one exception - the Muay Thai round kick isn't chambered. It's a great kick. It works fantastic at what it does. Just because it isn't chambered, doesn't make it bad - it just makes it different. There are probably some other non-chambered kicks in other styles that are perfectly good, as well.

There are SO MANY arts out there, that I bet you could find one that has all the things you like about Oom Yung Doe. It's pretty obvious that there

is good reason to suspect Oom Yung Doe, and be doubtful of it as an art. Make up your own mind of course, but it's obvious you already have doubts about it, otherwise why would you post with the question?

[oomyungdoeperson]

My instructor was not the one who stated that other martial arts didn't chamber their kicks, but he asked my peers (who went to TKD and other martial arts in the area) to demonstrate a round kick, and it came right from the ground. I asked a friend of mine who goes to Martial Arts World do demonstrate a few kicks, and they came from the ground as well. I'm sure you can understand why I drew this conclusion. I would appreciate it if someone could provide me with an unbiased, comprehensive source on martial arts as well. Book and website recommendations would be something I'd be very grateful for.

[dbrillha]

My instructor was not the one who stated that other martial arts didn't chamber their kicks, but he asked my peers (who went to TKD and other martial arts in the area) to demonstrate a round kick, and it came right from the ground. I asked a friend of mine who goes to Martial Arts World do demonstrate a few kicks, and they came from the ground as well. I'm sure you can understand why I drew this conclusion.

Sure, I guess I can see why you would think that from what you are saying. Just keep in mind a round kick coming from the ground isn't always a bad thing..

I would appreciate it if someone could provide me with an unbiased, comprehensive source on martial arts as well. Book and website recommendations would be something I'd be very grateful for.

There is a lot of information to be had at

http://groups.google.com/group/rec.martial-arts

[oomyungdoeperson]

But wouldn't it allow more time for the defender to realize what you are doing and perform a block?

[White Warlock]

Umm, you don't want to try and block a muay thai kick.

Properly performed kicks that do not chamber the knee before striking are power-oriented kicks, usually utilizing the entire body to generate velocity... like swinging a baseball bat.*

oomyungdoeperson, this is a disturbing comment, in that you indicated you have been practicing oom yung doe for almost 2 years now... and are not aware of this. I urgently recommend you step out of that test tube environment and find out what is 'really' going on out there.

As to your request for links, i presented a link to a previous discussion here, which includes links within it. As to sites on various arts, or on books, there are plenty. Please indicate specifically what it is you are asking for. A glossary/dictionary/encyclopedia on the various arts? A breakdown of the types of arts? A comparative of arts? A more detailed article on the system you are studying? ???

* A special note here is that the persons you have in your class could very well be 'posing' as martial artists from other styles... in the hopes such background would enhance their status in that particular school. It's a common behavior, although somewhat juvenile. Anyway, for them to state they are from TKD, and then to present 'non-chambered' kicks... sounds like they learned it wrong or were never really in it for long enough to grasp anything.

[oomyungdoeperson]

Yes, I had read that discussion before you posted the link. As for what sources, I suppose I am interested in what part of your body and to what extent each style develops, as well as how well it will prepare me for out of school situations.

I have to say, I am experiencing a conflict. One one side, there is what I hear, that Oom Yung Doe is a cult, it lacks value as a martial art, and is soley existing to take away my money. On the other hand, there is what I see. An instructor who has at least well above average abilities, and who has practiced Oom Yung Doe for 16 years, I myself grew from being slightly fat to trim and being on my way to becoming well developed. I have seen people have physical problems corrected, or helped (i.e. the way of walking that favors one foot removed, and a more balanced body). So I can not believe Oom Yung Doe is completely without value.

I have yet to see other martial arts schools, but from what my peers have mentioned (I believe I should state I am 14) of their experiences with other schools, I am strongly questioning the quality of other schools in my area.

[dbrillha]

One one side, there is what I hear, that Oom Yung Doe is a cult, it lacks value as a martial art, and is soley existing to take away my money. On the other hand, there is what I see. An instructor who has at least well above average abilities, and who has practiced Oom Yung Doe for 16 years, I myself grew from being slightly fat to trim and being on my way to becoming well developed. I have seen people have physical problems corrected, or helped (i.e. the way of walking that favors one foot removed, and a more balanced body). So I can not believe Oom Yung Doe is completely without value.

I have yet to see other martial arts schools, but from what my peers have mentioned (I believe I should state I am 14) of their experiences with other schools, I am strongly questioning the quality of other schools in my area.

Let me tell you a bit about my first experiances at a martial arts school, and it may give you some insight into your situation.

I had taken some parks and recs Karate classes, but the first actual school I studied at was a Kung Fu school. I was there for about a year, and earned the rank of "blue sash". The instructor and other students at this school would always talk trash about the Karate school down the street. How their techniques were bad, how they did stupid things, etc. To hear them talk, they were the lowest of the low.

Well, due to personal family reasons, I left this school. A few years later, in college I started taking martial arts from a professor there. Guess

who he was? the instructor from the much maligned school down the street. Turns out he was quite a good instructor with lots of skill, great teaching ability, and a really good attitude. He opened my eyes to lots of things I had never thought about with the martial arts. The instructor at my current school has heard of him, so apparently he is still at it. I would have been much better off spending that year with him at his

school down the street from the "Kung Fu" school.

Later on I heard from some of the other students at the "Kung Fu" school. They had discovered that the instructor there was a fake. The style he was claiming to teach didn't exist. He made it up. I talked to some people from other schools who had sparred with him - they said he was at a karate brown belt level at best. From what I have learned in the 16 or 17 years since I was at the "Kung Fu" school, I know that a lot of the techniques I learned there were entirely valid, but I'm not so sure all of them were actually "Kung Fu". I DID learn a lot there, so it wasn't without any value - but it certainly wasn't what the instructor said it was. This school when to some karate tournaments and did pretty good in sparring and forms, so obviously we learned something there. A school can be a bit dodgy and still do something for you.

The thing is there may be a better school nearby that is the REAL deal, as in my case. Life is too short to waste your training time on somethign that might be 50% valid and 50% smoke and mirrors.

Use your own judgement about your school, but if I were you - I'd spend and hour or two watching classes in every school within a 30 minute drive of where you are at. Then you might have some comparison.