a puncher versus a grappler...for you UFC/Pride and mma guys

[Adonis]

like subgrappler said there are few exceptions like chuck liddel and vandereli silva. who are good on take down defense as well as decent in the clinch. So they can utilize strikes more effectively.

Then again alot has to do with agression as well, or assertivness as well. example any one watch a couple episodes of TUF I will use this as an example since its on tv cause it can be used as more evidence since evidence then some of the stories my buddy did this or I saw that. As some people like to use.

When Jorge Gurgel faught jason von flute. Jorge had more training supposedly. He was better on the ground (bjj black belt) as well as a few years of muay thai training. Yet Jason beat him by landing more strikes. So it does come down to the fighter. The heart, the drive, and fighters emontial level and state of mind.

[Kajukenbopr]

if you are completely outfought(strikes) shouldnt you pay mind to your training? you are obviously doing somehting wrong when you train - u should at least be able to trade punches...

but anyways, in UFC the fights favor grapplers, in real life, the one who can come up with the best fight, be it stand up or on the ground, will win.

[elbows_and_knees]

fights don't really favor grapplers anymore...

[SubGrappler]

but anyways, in UFC the fights favor grapplers, in real life, the one who can come up with the best fight, be it stand up or on the ground, will win.

This has already been debated to death. UFC and other mixed martial arts organizations heavily favor strikers over grapplers. This is especially true of the UFC where the primary audience is American, which has a long tradition of boxing and doesnt quite understand the grappling game (like the Japanese, for example).

[White Warlock]

Agreed, and it favors both strikers and grapplers far over street-ugly.

[Socratic_Sifu]

Liddel, Silva, Belfort, Maurice Smith...

Just to name a few off the top of my head. Lots of top guys like to win by strikes.

It's not a matter of which you do, you need to be able to control where the fight takes place, and that means knowing a good deal of both even if you specialize in one.

There are no pure grapplers or strikers fighting anymore, It started that way, but has evolved into a distinct system of fighting.

What you are talking about isn't grappler vs Striker, it is Submission vs KO. Everyone that wants any chance has to be able to move and defend effectively from any position. The better fighter is the one who can control which positions the fight takes place in, and has an advantage in the one that it does.

I agree wholeheartedly--evidently the guy missed the pride fight where rorion gracie was knocked out by a single knee to the chin---by a grappler no less

[h2whoa]

What you are talking about isn't grappler vs Striker, it is Submission vs KO. Everyone that wants any chance has to be able to move and defend effectively from any position. The better fighter is the one who can control which positions the fight takes place in, and has an advantage in the one that it does.

I agree wholeheartedly--evidently the guy missed the pride fight where rorion gracie was knocked out by a single knee to the chin---by a grappler no less

A knee is a deadly weapon to have in your arsenal, I have the discussion with the bjj advocates. They say that the knee would never knock out a true grappling/submission master. I think that these people believe that a black belt makes them perfect, I think that a grandmaster could have an off day!!

[Adonis]

I don't refute that it is possible to get knocked out, but most MMA fighters that are in the top 10 to top 20 have very decent grappling experience.

Any way on a side note, who did Gracie faught that knocked him out? Not to mention it wasn't rorion. He hasn't faught in years. His fights were before the UFC ever started I believe. As far as events go.

So he wasn't ever in pride. Now other gracies how ever. Dan Henderson KO'd Renzo Gracie with upper cut/ wreslting sprawl when rezno tried to take him down. another gracie got KO'ed also.

Either way most of those strikers know HOW TO GRAPPLE. Thats the key. If you can't grapple or stop the grappler from taking you down. Your percentage of a win will be extremely low.

[h2whoa]

Thats true!! I think the general feeling is that purist martial artists are a dying breed!!

[Adonis]

Pretty much. Even regular BJJ isn't working to well in MMA. Submission % is going down, do to better submission defenses and take down defenses.

Fighters are getting insanely good. People like to remenice of the old UFC days of style vs. style. but those days are gone. It was new but I don't think those were the good ol days. Some people think. I think the fighters now are way better. As you see with Tank abbots return to the UFC and loosing every match in the first round. Then going to pride and loosing also.

Times change