Opinion on UFC

[TriangleMan]

I understand what Rick is saying. I am a former Marine I know how hard you guys train. No doubt it's very good training. As far as what this thread was about the UFC it is a ring or cage sport. I don't think a Marine in the cage with a pro would do well. Outside the cage could be another story. The UFC and Pride Fighters are great athletes. They call themselves warriors and that’s fine but outside the cage Marines are Warriors and so are Rangers, SF and a whole litany of others. It’s taking nothing away from a Marine to say that in the cage with a Liddell or Ortiz you probable wouldn’t do well.

I don’t think they would want to meet you in the desert either.

Absolutely correct. People in the armed forces, especially in the marines, are quite the physical specimens thanks to their rigorous physical training. They are trained to be weapons of war. Thing is that nowadays wars are fought with guns and almost never with fists, so hand to hand combat for a marine isnt going to be a big issue. Hes probably never going to have to resort to it.

I teach a lot of guys who are marines, and even one kid who went into the Seals program. Very tough, very physical people, however the whole "Im just crazy" aspect isnt going to get you far in a fight. Everyone in this conversation is human, so just as the marine is going to handle the MMA fighter should they engage in a fight with firearms, so to will the MMA fighter handle the marine should they engage in unarmed combat. Afterall, who do you think is teaching the marines what to do in unarmed combat?

[straightblast]

Would a navy seal or a MMA have a better chance of defending himself in a bar with a man bent on killing them with a knife? That is a real senario, unarmed combat is only for the cadge. A seal in a bar will be armed or at least know how to improvise a kali stick from a cue stick.

[parkerlineage]

Okay, I actually sat down and watched an entire two UFC matches, and I rescind most of my derogatory comments that I've made. I still think people put too much stock in it, but those guys are pretty hardcore - I saw some suggestions I would have to some of them, but I don't think I'd want to fight them, anyway!

[TriangleMan]

Would a navy seal or a MMA have a better chance of defending himself in a bar with a man bent on killing them with a knife? That is a real senario, unarmed combat is only for the cadge. A seal in a bar will be armed or at least know how to improvise a kali stick from a cue stick.

Actually no- Ive worked in a bar for the past 3 years and Ive had my fair share of encounters. First off:

Fighting an armed opponent is going to put you at a grave disadvantage no matter who you are- remember why weapons were utilized by people in the first place- to overcome anothers physical superiority and weapons such as knives do a GREAT job in doing that.

A "Real" scenario is anything that happens in real life. Most altercations do not involve weapons and most are not a fight to the death. If somone initiates a fight with you, you're not going to have time to walk over to the billiards table to grab a pool cue- this isnt Road House where you've got 10 guys coming at you single file. Real fights are quick, brutal, and chaotic, and space is not a luxury you're going to enjoy.

Seals and soldiers are meant to fight for armed combat- that is their speciality and that is what they're the best at. Unarmed combat is left to those who practice it the most (professional fighters). Once again, is it THESE people who are teaching the Seals and the other soldiers the very techniques they use for unarmed combat.

[ff100]

Think of it like this. Take them out of their comfort zone.

A boxer is a good striker... dont stand with him.. get him on the ground.

A wrestler... dont get down on the ground with him.

Karateka.... get on the ground with him....

You get the idea.

[straightblast]

A "Real" scenario is anything that happens in real life. Most altercations do not involve weapons and most are not a fight to the death. If somone initiates a fight with you, you're not going to have time to walk over to the billiards table to grab a pool cue-

.

I would like to see the statistics that most altercations do not involve weapons, it is more of an opinon than a statement. Who would walk over to a billiards table and pick up a stick, Unless your playing. I was trying to point out, use the weapons in your enviorment- chairs, ash trays,pocket change,improvise and be aware.

[elbows_and_knees]

A "Real" scenario is anything that happens in real life. Most altercations do not involve weapons and most are not a fight to the death. If somone initiates a fight with you, you're not going to have time to walk over to the billiards table to grab a pool cue-

.

I would like to see the statistics that most altercations do not involve weapons, it is more of an opinon than a statement. Who would walk over to a billiards table and pick up a stick, Unless your playing. I was trying to point out, use the weapons in your enviorment- chairs, ash trays,pocket change,improvise and be aware.

Based on my own experience as a bouncer, I would agree with Triangle man, however, yeah seeing some stats would be cool. I have only been involved in six altercations incolving weapons in my line of work - two involving a knife and three involving beer bottles, one with a moet bottle.

on the street, my experience has been the same - no weapons in most cases. I think that most people tend to have an over romanticized view of what streetfighting is and is not. Granted, it is dangerous, but you always here MA guys say "don't go to the ground cuz you can get cut on glass and dude's buddies will stomp you!" I have never been stomped by anyone's buddies, nor have I been cut by glass.

[Orca]

To paraphrase what somebody said in another thread: What's this about grown-ups fighting in the street? I grew up in a very tough neighborhood and let me tell, you, fighting to see who beats up who it's a thing of children and preadolescents. Once people are adults, even in a tough neighborhood (or maybe specially so), they generally dont want to fight each other. I have trained in martial arts for many years, and I never get into any fights. Specially in bars, people tend to be peaceful they dont wanna mess with the wrong drunk person and get shot. Maybe things in the suburbs are different and people duke it out in their front lawns?

Growing up the story about street fighters was usually the same: the 'guapos de barrio' (Puerto Rican for 'street toughs') that had lifted some weights or took some boxing or martial arts and who liked to beat other adults up would almost always turn up dead in some alley, stabbed, shot or their heads bashed in by baseball bats, because they would inevitably end up messing up the wrong person. If they were very lucky, they would get jailed for asssault before that happened. I'm willing to bet the same happens almost everywhere.

[alsey]

To paraphrase what somebody said in another thread: What's this about grown-ups fighting in the street? I grew up in a very tough neighborhood and let me tell, you, fighting to see who beats up who it's a thing of children and preadolescents. Once people are adults, even in a tough neighborhood (or maybe specially so), they generally dont want to fight each other. I have trained in martial arts for many years, and I never get into any fights. Specially in bars, people tend to be peaceful they dont wanna mess with the wrong drunk person and get shot. Maybe things in the suburbs are different and people duke it out in their front lawns?

that's a really good point. i think that once you get out of your teens, threats tend to change from other guys wanting to prove how tough they are to random attacks by muggers and the like. its a change of threat though, not a dissapearance of threat. you still have to be prepared.

[straightblast]

What are we considering altercations? Does mugging, Robbery, rape, car jackings fit into that catagory? Can an altercation be an assult and one with a weapon, if we include the above assults then the statistics will go up. I do think that it would be vary rare to come up against a trained Arnis fighter than a drunk guy with a knife....If I had my coice drunk guy..lol