Black Belt in 2-3 yrs?

[White Warlock]

It has been my opinion that a properly obtained BB is like a properly obtained marriage license. It is not something one obtains to marry two persons, it is something someone obtains to satisfy bureaucratic requirements of two people that are, for all intensive purposes, already married (when such is not the case, divorce is more likely to be the end result). I.e., for all intensive purposes, a person should obtain a BB because he already is one. The little paper helps in presenting a satisfier for bureaucratic issues such as requirements by organizations, lenders, etc. To look further is to treat the symbol as if it were somehow 'deitific' in and of itself. Idolization.

[tkdBill]

for all intensive purposes, a person should obtain a BB because he already is one. The little paper helps in presenting a satisfier for bureaucratic issues such as requirements by organizations, lenders, etc. To look further is to treat the symbol as if it were somehow 'deitific' in and of itself. Idolization.

Well said, I agree with this part of your post.

It has been my opinion that a properly obtained BB is like a properly obtained marriage license. It is not something one obtains to marry two persons, it is something someone obtains to satisfy bureaucratic requirements of two people that are, for all intensive purposes, already married

Perhaps I'm living in a fantasy world, but as the parent of 3 teenagers, I like to think this is not necessarily true. I'm hoping my boys are not effectively married (i.e. living with their girlfriend) when they get a marriage license.

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[y2_sub]

Aye, the goal is not the coveted black belt. The goal is to obtain knowledge, along with skills.

I 2nd that! and people that are rushing to black belt..then whats the point? You can't really say your a black belt if you know absolutly nothing!

Sometimes black belt is important , especially if you want to instruct , I am not saying that you must rush to a BB , but if you know you deserve it ( thats after 4 or 5 years of severe training) then why not taking it ??

[y2_sub]

Of course most students NEVER make it to black belt.

Yes , few only make it to BB , why do you think is the reason ??

[orion82698]

I think this is another reason why I'm looking into a different school. Only after 2 weeks, I feel like they're just giving the belts out. Granted, it has only been two weeks, but I already got promoted to advance white.

[orion82698]

2 years?!?!?!?! RUN!!!! Far, far away.

I seen it happen at my dojang in 2 and a 1/2 years (long story), but my wimpy 2nd gup/kyu butt is better than them (I have been in TKD for 4 years with previous experience).

My school doesn't "promise" black belts unless you get on this "leadership instructor exelerated" thingy. It never works. Both my boyfriend and I turned it down when asked to do it. He got his BB in 3 and a 1/2 years (also training 4 years) and I'm just a 2nd gup (my choice ... I don't want no stinkin' gift LOL).

Sorry. I'm also kind of venting LOL

What is the name of the dojo you study at? This sounds very farmiliar to where I am.

[ramymensa]

I also think this is something to be avoided. An instructor cannot promise a BB in a certain amount of time since there are so many "variables" along the way. And 2 years to BB is way to fast (unless you are training for 6 hours a day, 7 days a week).

I'd consider another dojo too.

[lgm]

Most reputable karate schools, particularly those with international clout, usually require an average of 4 years of regular karate training, from whitebelt to blackbelt and the passing of all preparatory kyu gradings.

The value and significance of the the black belt and the BB certificate depends so much on what standards were set and subsequently met by the student. The higher the standards and stricter the requirements, the more valuable and prestigious these two symbols of achievement will have. The more rigid or difficult the requirements probably but not always reveal the comparable status of a BB from organization to another.

I don't know about other karate organizations but at JKA Phils-PTKF, one difficult requirement for passing Shodan rank, after almost an hour of kihon and kata self-demonstration, is the much awaited, closed door (no public allowed as well as other karate students except the brownbelts taking the exam and the BB examiners) "gauntlet kumite" (I coined this for identification purposes only as we don't have an official name for it, except "kumite").

In this "gauntlet kumite, the shodan candidate is compelled to fight 6 to 12 blackbelts and BB assistant instructors at 3 to 5 minutes in full-contact kumite, in unbroken succession, without any time out, except injury time out. The candidate must try to remain standing on his feet at all times and continue fighting, must stand up again and fight everytime he is knocked down, and whatever the pain he is experiencing, he must not give up and withdraw during this part of the exam.

Every shodan in our organization since 1965 up to the present has to go through this baptism of fire and initiation into the prestigious blackbelt rank, which is the traditional JKA Honbu training that our Sasaki Sensei has brought to our organization from JKA Japan in the mid-60s. According to him, this type of exam is given for sandan rank in JKA Japan during his training there prior to his commission by Nakayama to set up karate instruction in the Philippines in 1965. He instituted this exam tradition for shodan in JKA Phils.-PTKF and has remain unbroken to this day.

While being proficient at defense and attack is basic to pass this shodan exam, it is the candidate's fighting spirit that is principally tested by this "brutal" method. His determination to survive despite overwhelming odds are put to a big challenge. In the streets, you may be outnumbered, outfought by superior forces, but you will fight to the finish and never give up a righteous fight for self-preservation and those of your loved ones. This probably is the very essence of such an unpopular test. For some a sublime and noble goal, for others barbaric and obnoxious.

If you ask me, I won't want to go through it again. Yet I'm happy I made it through without any major problem, which now simply exist as pain memories that provide some inspirational comfort to an aging karate like yours truly. Looking back, I still feel more lucky than karate proficient to have made it then.

In comparison, my sandan exam was a breeze, but that's another story.

Personally, I know this is considered to be a "barbaric" type of shodan exam by many people and though I narrated it here, I would not recommend it to any karate organization in other parts of the world. Many countries have strict laws against such initiations, I believe.

Edited October 3, 2005 by lgm

[ShotokanKid]

IMHO, any dojo that "promises/guarantees" a black belt in a certain time frame is a McDojo. Run, don't walk, to the nearest exit and keep a good hold of your wallet and check book!

Yup, I agree.

Most reputable karate schools, particularly those with international clout, usually require an average of 4 years of regular karate training, from whitebelt to blackbelt and the passing of all preparatory kyu gradings.

I think it's reasonable to give an estimate for a minimum number of years. I think for an adult, it's reasonable to get your BB in 3 years (if you come to every class and train your heart out) For anyone under 16 or so, I think it should take at least 4 or 4 1/2 years. I agree that no dojo should promise or guarantee a BB in a certain amount of time. I think the students should have to test and try very hard to get a belt, not have the belt just given to the, I think it should also depend on how often you come to class. In our dojo, we require students to attend at least 70% of classes offered to them.

[shotochem]

2 years?!?!?!?! RUN!!!! Far, far away.

I seen it happen at my dojang in 2 and a 1/2 years (long story), but my wimpy 2nd gup/kyu butt is better than them (I have been in TKD for 4 years with previous experience).

My school doesn't "promise" black belts unless you get on this "leadership instructor exelerated" thingy. It never works. Both my boyfriend and I turned it down when asked to do it. He got his BB in 3 and a 1/2 years (also training 4 years) and I'm just a 2nd gup (my choice ... I don't want no stinkin' gift LOL).

Sorry. I'm also kind of venting LOL

You, Vent.....Nahhhh!!!!!

I am starting to see the same thing. I understand people have got to make a living......

It seems like all of the recent BB can't fight their way out of a wet paper bag!!!

I don't know whats going on they are all excellent point fighters but they just can't free fight or do anything I would consider scary. I thought it was supposed to be a "Martial" art?

Too many kids, too few adults. Maybe I'm just getting old and bored and need a change.

-Marc