Student Drop-Outs

[senseiblackbelt]

Hi all -

Just wanted your opinion on a subject I'm sure everyone has encountered. We've been opened for 3 years in this area. We are constantly working on upgrading our curriculum and keeping it exciting as well as informative. My husband and I work all the time on keeping our attitudes in check and keeping ourselves education on the cutting edge martial arts training. We're members of NAPMA and MAIA also, so we get plenty of material to help keep the school refreshed, as well as ourselves too.

As administrative director, I've recently implemented contracts as part of the commitment to earning black belt. We've not touched any existing students, only new ones signing up. It seems to be working well for our new students with no problems.

The problem we are having now is that we see a trend (with students that aren't on contract) when someone has reached a blue/purple belt rank (about 1 year into the program) they decide to quit. We have a really great program here, but it just seems that the "commitment" has not gotten through to them or their parents. We work extensively with our students and they become part of our family. The big problem we are faced with is that they quit without even calling to let us know what is going on. We don't find out until they are called back (only after missing a week or two of classes). This bothers me a whole lot. I take it really personal. It feels very hurtful to know that we have been nothing more than a drop-off location or babysitting convenience. Working with them day in and day out for a year, and everything short of an explanation or a courtesy call.

My husband and I have discussed that maybe it's best to just work on getting a whole new crew of students and parents with a new attitude of commitment back up with contracts. I know we'll always have those few students who don't want to achieve their black belt or quit before completing the course, but it has really gotten out of hand, and at least with new students on contract they are less prone to quit because their parents have signed an agreement to continue and the parents have something to fall back on.

I also keep wondering if it is something that we are teaching or the way we are teaching and the parents aren't being honest enough to tell us so that we can fix the problem (if in fact there is a problem).

I wonder if I'm the only one who feels this way or do other instructors in this forum feel the same way and take it personal. It's hard not to take it personal when this is your livelihood and every student counts. I know there's nothing we can do about the existing non-contract members, but at the same time I feel such a disloyalty and disappointment.

Thanks for your time.

[tkdBill]

Relax, it's probably not anything about you or your program. It is normal for some of your students to quit at some point, and about a year into their training it happens more than we like. It is a fact that most people who start training in MA's do not make it to black belt. Blue belt is a fairly normal dropping off point. The training becomes more difficult, and their progress slows down. In the beginning, it's all exciting and learning new cool things every class. As time goes on, they must polish and perfect techniques which can seem less exciting.

That doesn't mean you shouldn't fight back! Membership agreements (don't use the "C" word) are a good idea, it helps them understand the level of committment up front. In my school, we are introducing a Jr Leadership program for blue belts and up. We have a special class for leadership training every week, and they get special t-shirts and patches on their uniform. The Jr Leaders have to set the example for lower ranking students and help lead the classes. So far their is much excitement about the program.

By the way, people seldom tell you they are quitting because they aren't planning on quitting. It just happens. They skip classes for a week or so to take time off, then a week becomes two. They just stop coming, even though they have not actually made up their mind to quit. Of course some people are just inconsiderate.

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[TangSooGuy]

This is a tough one, I'll admit. I have to do things month-to-month right now because I run things out of a YMCA.

I have a 90% retention rate for this year so far, but in past years I have seen kids dropping out.

It really depends on why they're leaving, though.

If it is because the kid genuinely doesn't want to be there anymore, contracts won't help, in my opinion. These kids just make their parents lives miserable (and sometimes yours too) until they don't have to come anymore.

On the other hand, I have seen some kids leaving more because of apathetic and uninvolved parents than I would care to see. This is where the contract/ committment really comes into play. If you can get the parents committed to the kids training, it helps tremendously.

I plan to open a full time school someday, and I'm not sure I'd use contracts, but I can see the benefit for this reason, particularly with parents that view it as just another hobby, where their child can leave for a few months, and come back ready to resume again from where they were. Unfortunately, it doesn't work that way.

[jnpnshr411]

That's normal, most people that start quit somewhere along that line. Most people that I knew when I was white quit around their orange and green belts. Its nothing about the curriculum its just that some people find it boring after that point.(why they do is crazy?)

[pineapple]

I also don't believe that it is your fault because it is normal for many to drop out. I think a lot of times it is because it gets more difficult as you move up in rank.

Student dropouts is the reason that it is important to continually bring in new students and eventually you will end up with a hardcore group that sticks it out!

[KempoTiger]

heh, get used to it. I've been teaching for 6 years and training for 8. Guess how many students are still training that I started with? 6.

The amount of focus, and discpline it takes to achieve a black belt in my school isn't so easy, and I believe it's the same way in your school, so expect a number like 1 in a 100 making it all the way to black belt.

Also children are finicky and will tend to just drop things at the moment it becomes boring. I tend to try and keep each student excited about what's they're doing by finding out about them individually and making it more appealing depending on their personality or what they wish to aspire to.

Keep in mind as well that around the blue-purple belt area, I think every system with a belt system loses students around there. That's when the material begins to pile up and forgetting stuff begins to take a toll on their confidence and enthusiasm. I would suggest implementing a review class once or twice a month, as well as encouraging your students to come to you if they're facing any difficulties. You'd be surprised at how easy a private lesson or a simple talk can motivate your students to go farther, and help retain your student count.

Good luck!

[KempoTiger]

Oh and another suggestion, if you don't already I would suggest incorporating games at the end of kids classes. At my school we have an array of games that we've developed through the years. Most of these games are karate related somehow and make them work on different things such as coordination, focus, teamwork, or even fighting tact.

Other games of course are just fun

By adding games to the end of classes, children regardless of whether they're enjoying the material or not will have something to look forward to and will continue to come to class. To use the game to get your students more motivated about class, you can tell them that they can have an extra long game on a certain day if they work hard in class, or let them pick the game for the day if they remember a certain amount of moves.

Combining this with traditional motivational tools can help get your students back on track and excited about going to class again rather than having them just up and stop taking classes because they'd rather play video games or hang out in the pool all summer long. (and yes expect to lose a substantial # of child students in the summer if you haven't figured that out yet....nice weather destroys childrens will to go to class....the way around that is having beach classes )

Whatever you do, just remember that students quitting 9 out of 10 times isn't your fault, so don't take it so hard.

If you want some ideas for games, I quite literally have a book written on them, so just PM me.

[kivikala]

Drop out rates for my school have been pretty consistent on percentage basis and rather predictable. I have a very small school so the actual numbers swing wildly from moment to moment but over the years (46 years next month) some statistics have fallen out which seem to match national numbers that I've read about. Now my numbers reflect primarily adult students. I never counted kids in any statistics unless they became an adult.

Predictably we will lose 50% within the first 6 months. By the end of the year we will lose another 25%. Of the remaining 25% only 1% will make it to Black Belt.

I also teach MA classes for a private high school and even there the numbers from semester to semester, year to year, seem to be similar. Of course after 4 years they are predictably gone and each year seniors are leaving. But the statistics seem to be about the same 50/25/1 even though the program is not the same as a regular dojo.

I've often asked why? Responses from students have varied from life situations preventing their continued training, lack of interest or "gee I want to try something else like soccer". Money has never been a reason. Marriage (or divorce) has been a predominant cause for adults but usually in a few years their kids magically appear at the doorstep. In several instances I've trained 3 generations of a family. (At that point I knew I was getting old.) But most overwhelmingly people wanted to "try it out" and found out it was more work than they anticipated or did not want to make a lifetime commitment to the art. (Which I can understand.) The saddest thing is when I lose a student due to some fatal accident, war, or just old age. Particularly when they have been training for 15 or more years. I feel I've lost too many this way. But, I have learned not to take it personally. I have no control over this as each person has free will and I encourage that it be exercised.

My first teacher always harped on me about making sure my life's priorities were correct. I am still hanging in there, so, I know there is at least one student that isn't going to drop out anytime soon.

[fallen_milkman]

Oh and another suggestion, if you don't already I would suggest incorporating games at the end of kids classes.

Ahhh, that takes me back to my days of Sifu Says. It worked just like Simon Says, but with Kung Fu practise in there. It was lots of fun when I was a young'un. I'm sure the Japanese teachers of you could adapt it to "Sensei Says". The last one in got to be the "Simon" of the next game, a prodigious honor!

[KempoTiger]

Oh and another suggestion, if you don't already I would suggest incorporating games at the end of kids classes.

Ahhh, that takes me back to my days of Sifu Says. It worked just like Simon Says, but with Kung Fu practise in there. It was lots of fun when I was a young'un. I'm sure the Japanese teachers of you could adapt it to "Sensei Says". The last one in got to be the "Simon" of the next game, a prodigious honor!

Hahaha, yes we do play that game. We call it Sensei says if Sensei is running it, or Nidan says if I am, or Shodan says if one of the first degrees are. The best trick is for you to say "Sensei says" or some other title that's not yours and half the room gets out