kenpo vs kickboxing

[elbows_and_knees]

I'm not saying kickboxing is bad, far from it, but Kenpo is more street oriented.

not true at all. the term "street oriented" is really nonexistant, IMO. If I elbow you in the jaw, I am just as capable of ending the fight as someone who tries to hit an opponent in the throat. people say "we will kick them in the knee, we will eye gouge them, we will hit the throat, etc", which really does not make them more street oriented at all. it merely means you have a different tactic. I elbow the jaw, punch the liver, etc. it's just as "street effective", if not more so, because I am not only hitting larger targets, but I am able to do so in practice in most cases, which you are not.

[elbows_and_knees]

a kickboxer trains by rules and ,if traditional, somewhat like Karate.

not true. traditional kickboxing is the older thai style - muay boran. the kickboxing you are referring to is not traditional at all. it is a combination of karate and boxing that allows full contact hits as opposed to light contact.

however, Kenpo can train to be full of hits most kickboxers would call illegal or dishonorable.

A series of hits(which might not seem too hard by themselves) can make a Kenpo practitioner a dreaded opponent.

my school is located inside of a kempo school. One of our guys is a black belt in the kempo system. He tells us how easy it is for him to beat them since he started thai boxing. I personally don't consider anything dishonorable. there are things that are illegal, but that doesn't mean they are dishonorable. you have to watch it when you make such broad generalizations.

Have anyone seen " The perfect weapon" ? the guy fighting in that movie practices Kenpo and displays it very well.

I have that movie on tape. i saw it years ago when it first came out. "I have shown you the dragon, but you have not seen him..."

[elbows_and_knees]

Kickboxing tends to go for sports. The same punches as in boxing, combined with kicks like Tae Kwon Do.

that is incorrect, as I pointed out above. Also, elbows and knees are used, and there are takedowns.

Although both train to fight, kenpo does tend to be harder than Kickboxing, Mixing various hits that make any combination a devastating combo.

the average kickboxer, be it american or thai style is in much better shape than your avg. tma and spars regularly. From what I've seen of kempo, it's definitely not harder.

[Kajukenbopr]

Muaythaiboxer - you've seen kenpo people practice light contact - when you are learning to fight you have to start with light contact, and even when you already know how to fight, you practice light contact to demonstrate that you're not a hothead just throwing a bunch of hits, but a fighter who knows how to fight, what to use and is able to show he knows it.

[Kajukenbopr]

elbows_and_knees

we can agree to disagree because you've probably seen good kickboxers while I've been able to see people practicing hard in Kenpo.

Shame you've seen people who dont train as they're supposed to......

I dont mean to insult kickboxing, it is a martial art, just like any other and it deserves to be recognized as such.

[y2_sub]

as what elbows_and_knees said , just because kickboxing is sport oriented dosn't meen that they it is not usefull in the street .

Think about it , if a kickboxer is able to knockdown his opponent wearing gloves , what's he able to do with bear knuckle hands ??

[EndlessDave]

I never said my school trains poorly. I think it trains quite well. I wouldn't still be there otherwise, would I?

Useoforce, yes that's the sort of "grappling" we do in my studio. There are few full body holds or mounted positions, but there are lots of wrist holds to maintain striking range or takedowns followed my strikes to a grounded opponent.

And also, I think that there is such a thing as "street oriented" and I think Nick Cerio's Kenpo is it. It's not street oriented because it does eye gouges or kicks to the knee (and we DO do those, but we do the regular old punch to the face far more often); it's street oriented because we practice defenses against attacks like headlocks, bear hugs, and lapel grabs in addition to straight punches and kicks. We also do self defense against knife, gun, and club attacks. Most of these techniques are fairly useless in a ring, but they'll help you if an unskilled attacker comes at you on the street.

Edit: Oh! And The Perfect Weapon is a great cheesy action flick, and its intent is to show off kenpo. It's actually dedicated to the ed parker. That said, however, I think it does a poor job most of the job of showing off kenpo, mostly because the camera tends to move around a lot in such a way as to make it hard to follow exactly what's happening. Parkerlineage, you might actually recognize a few of the techniques he does though. It's cool when you can name the technique you see on the screen to your buddies. Check it out!

[elbows_and_knees]

Most of these techniques are fairly useless in a ring, but they'll help you if an unskilled attacker comes at you on the street.

depends on the escape. the situations you posted (or things very similar) can occur in mma and also in the clinch in thai boxing.

[parkerlineage]

tsdtony: What is your experience in seeing Ed Parker's Kenpo? I would have to assume it is limited, since one of our major points are the three body mechanics and how they relate to every single strike/block.

EndlessDave: I can't say I've ever heard of Nick Ceiro's Kenpo - okay, I've heard of it...the name is familiar...but I can't place it. Of course, I advocate sticking with Parker, but in any event, I'm sure it's close enough. We have techniques for all those as well...I think that Kenpo is stree effective...tell me, whomever said it first - is not a punch easier to land than an eye-gouge? I wouldn't say they're totally useless 'in the ring'...you can adapt principles for what needs to be done...but, Ceiro or Parker...keep advocating our style, my man (I assume).

Muaythaiboxer: Whomever you saw practiced light contact. Do not assume it is that way for the rest of us. What rank were these people, for one thing? In my dojo, at the brown/black belt level, we throw punches that knock people back four feet, kicks that drop 350 pound guys to their knees (well, I do), and blows that leave men's heads ringing the next day. And that's using control...

Not to criticize kickboxing at all! I'm sure if one of them kicked someone in the head, the fight would be over. Just defending my art in its right.

Peace;

Parkerlineage

[elbows_and_knees]

Muaythaiboxer: Whomever you saw practiced light contact. Do not assume it is that way for the rest of us. What rank were these people, for one thing? In my dojo, at the brown/black belt level, we throw punches that knock people back four feet, kicks that drop 350 pound guys to their knees (well, I do), and blows that leave men's heads ringing the next day. And that's using control...

I don't know about his experiences, but just two months ago, my thai boxing coach helped the kempo guys with a black belt test (we are all friends, so the teacher wanted him to spar with the guys he was testing) He dropped one of them to the floor with a liver punch, and almost KOed another with a spinning backfist. None of them did any damage to him at all, though they were able to hit him.

That's not a knock on kem/npo in any way, just something to consider for those talking about how much more "lethal" it is than thai boxing.