To All Veterans and Active Military

[Shorinryu Sensei]

Like Aodhan, I was enlisted in the USAF. We received no hand-to-hand training, but I was sure to find a local school where ever I was stationed to keep active. (Being a computer programmer, I guess there wasn't much of a need for hand-to-hand!)

When was the last time you saw or even heard of the Air Force or Navy (not counting the S.E.A.L.s of course) being involved in close combat? Not meaning any offense here, but their duties in those services aren't generally with eyeball to eyeball contact with their enemy as much as the Army and Marines are.

My experience in hand to hand training while in the Army was a joke. The Viet Nam war was still going on at that time, yet the training we had was very, very poor...to the point of being non-existent. Back then, karate classes/instructors were few and far between.

[ninjanurse]

Because of my MOS I received more hand-to-hand combat after basic training (Army MP). During basic it was pretty....basic. Mostly dis-arming & disabling. Bayonet was just stab, stab, stab!

[UseoForce]

Thanks, Ninjanurse, thats what I was looking for. I'd love to hear some more detail and about how long this training took. Thanks.

[ninjanurse]

Basic joint locks for submission and control. A few basic throws and chokes. Kicks for disabling. After that knife & gun disarms. Most advanced training is sought out individually.

[granmasterchen]

I am currently in misawa japan and teach the forces on the base martial arts.

as far as back when i was in the military, we didnt' learn any thing in basic training, when I went off to special forces training we were taught by some of the worst looking marine martial arts instructors ever, the worst techniques you could possibly imagine is what they taught. After a couple small confrontations with me and the instructor that left the marine on the groun in each scenario I was elected to teach the martial arts combat program for the base which eventually led to what I do now as a military contracted civilian to go around and help teach at military bases.

Basically the only groups that are made to attend are special forces and military police. The programs they go through are very very very basic and short, nothing to even compare to a martial arts program. We cover some basic aikido manipulation and some submition holds along with strikes and escapes, we train on how to disarm and how to use the batons and similar techs. But just like any art form, if it is not trained on a regular basis, you lose the skill. I encourage the people that I train to see me at any time for further free training to maintain their skills and even enhance them.

So feel free to ask me any questions that you may like, i'll try to respond as best I can in the time differences that are placed on me and sleep patterns and all.

[Jiffy]

Hi There,

I've never been in the service, but my brother is still in the Australian Army (11 years) and we have discussed this.

Basically, the hand to hand combat they have received is laughable. He has come to some of my classes when he comes home and was amazed at some of the stuff we do. I couldn't believe he has never done it. Even though he has done two lots of active service.... still not much hand to hand training.

[Skeptic 2004]

I went to "The Zoo" with Shorin Ryuu and got my commission in the U.S. Air Force. At the time we went through, our basic training was very different from the rest of the Air Force (read: big haze). The closest we got to "unarmed" combat training in basic was beating the heck out of each other with pugal sticks during a competitve event called "Big Bad Basic."

The P.E. curriculum includes a required boxing or wrestling class (an all too brief 10 lessons) during freshman year and 2 mandatory unarmed combat classes of laughable quality during junior year (each 8 lessons a piece). Thank God for our old instructor and the Traditional Karate Club at the Zoo...

As far as the rest of the Air Force goes, unless you're pararescue/combat control/security forces, you don't get any unarmed combat training. Personally, I think it's a travesty that we don't. Everybody in the Marine Corps is a rifleman and marine first and their MOS second, and when it comes down to it they know how to pick up a gun or go barehanded and beat the bad guys. The Air Force should be the same. We deploy just like everyone else and have the potential to be in just as many sticky situations (who's to say the air field won't get overrun, or a terrorist somehow sneaks in to the air base to do something dastardly, or if you're on a fighter/bomber/transport/cargo plane that crashes behind enemy lines/terrorist controlled region and you survive in good shape?); we should learn how to adequately defend ourselves and not be a liability to anyone who might be covering our rears.

[drunken.master]

As far as the rest of the Air Force goes, unless you're pararescue/combat control/security forces, you don't get any unarmed combat training. Personally, I think it's a travesty that we don't.

I couldn't agree more.

[UseoForce]

Skeptic 2004

I wish more people thought like that! I've been saying the same thing forever!

Great replies all.

granmasterchen

You say you're a civilian contracted by the military to teach unarmed combat. That sounds interesting I've always wondered how the whole contracting process worked, but it's probably different in the states than in Japan (?).

So we don't have a single Marine or Army man here at Karateforums?

[Adonis]

IN basic I had one day of H2H combat training more like 2 or 3 hours of actual training. That was a few years ago.

The US Army has re-structured its combatives trianing.

check out https://www.modercombatives.org to look at what the Army currenly is doing as far as H2H combat training.

I have had some training after basic as well. Its required in the new combatives program which is now army doctirine. every unit soon will be doing it weekly.

The program can be found in army field manules

FM 3-25.150 I believe is the manuel.

reason why I gave the web site and FM I would be making several posts and filling this forum up with alot of reading material as well as my own personal opinion to much writing I want to do and I doubt people are going to go through the trouble to read all of the info. the moderncombatives.org is the best for getting the info for what you want as far as what the army is teaching now.

Edited June 26, 2005 by Adonis