Best for UFC/MMA?

[elbows_and_knees]

Good point as well, but when was the last time Chuck submitted someone? Or Vanderlei for that matter? Its no secret they can handle themselves on the ground but Chuck has said he would much rather stay on his feet to end the fight

Right, but why do you think he stays on his feet? It's his knowledge of grappling. He knows the takedowns in and out, which makes him more adept at defending them. He could not do this if he weren't such a skilled grappler.

[elbows_and_knees]

Alot of Kung Fu styles like Wing Chun or Hung gar have movements that would be illigal in the octagon so I know they would have to modify there techniques. I also know that some MMA are cross training Kung Fu, BJJ, Muay Thai. So a few may be using it without anyone knowing

Nah. It's because the training methods they used sucked for what they were trying to do. Eye gouges were actually allowable in the early UFC matches. If you used one, you would get fined, but if your opponent couldn't continue, you still won the fight.

That said, there are a few kung fu guys competing. There is a taiji school in canada that competes in local mma and does well. There is also a WC school in australia that has been doing well locally. Sami berik competes mma as well. there are a few out there, not many. The few that do realize that they have to train properly for their event - they can't just step up and win.

[SubGrappler]

one question for the people that have been into the ufc for a long time,why did the kung-fu guys suck in the octagon?

Lets see if I can address this without starting a war....

First off, the idea that cant work in the UFC because its techniques are illegal is a bogus statement used often by people who fear stepping into the octagon or are simply closed minded. Everyone fights under the same rules.

There are ways to eye gouge, bite, and headbutt in Brazilian Jiu Jitsu, Wrestling, and Judo, but you dont hear those fighters complain about it. All the techniques that are now outlawed in the UFC were at one point of time very legal and contrary to popular belief, biting, eye gouging, and groin shots were not as effective at ending/ turning the tide of a fight as once thought. Things like headbutting were removed because they were so effective at opening up cuts, which stopped fights often (elbows do this as well).

Now why didnt kung fu work....

Technically it did- Jason DeLucia is a shining example of a kung fu fighter who does well in MMA https://www.jasondelucia.com

He holds a +.500 record in MMA competition, which is quite successful. Why didnt the other kung fu guys do well?

1. Lack of knowledge of ground fighting, which was a downfall for many standup fighters. Using a low crouched stance wasnt very effective against someone attempting to take you down- being heavy on your feet is indeed the opposite of what you want to do to avoid takedowns.

2. Lack of striking combinations. Popular striking styles, such as boxing and muay thai, make use of combinations, setups, fakes, and body shots. These may exist in kung fu, but are the speciality of boxers/muay thai fighters in the same way that grappling is to wrestlers/jiu jitsu fighters.

3. Lack of enough quality sparring time. The styles that are emphasized in MMA, such as wrestling, BJJ, boxing, and muay thai, have heavy emphasis on live training and full contact sparring/competition which best prepares a fighter for the real deal.

4. Bad Luck

Not all these points apply to all kung fu. There were those who couldnt combine attacks, those that couldnt be light on their feet, and those that had never actually fought before. The bad luck part goes against someone like DeLucia who was a quality fighter and got paired up with a quality grappler. After Royce, Jason was a top notch contender to be a UFC champion, barring the weight advantage people like Severn, Kimo, and Shamrock would have had on him. There were also no weight restrictions in early MMA events, which led to a few very lopsided fights.

[BLueDevil]

when I said some movements are illegal I ddint mean that barred them completely from competing. Im not making excuses, but to compete NOW THAT THERE ARE RULES they would have to modify some techniques. Like Subgrappler said BJJ has some moves they cant use but modified, the same rule could go for Kung Fu guys, they could modify just as easily...

and elbows_and_knees

like I said its no secret they can handle themselves on the ground I know how long they have both been grappling

[Goju_boi]

hey subgrappller,you are somewhat right on your theories.

1.some kung-fu stlyes do have a little bit of grappling(of course not as much as bjj),and there are more stances than the low crouched stance

2.kung fu guys can have the combination,set ups , fakes,and body shots.It just dependes how they fight.

3.kung fu does have full contact,you just have to go to a school that teaches u that aspect.

4.I guess I agree with you on that one

with that said think a Kung-fu guy that has experience and knows some ground fighting can handle themselves in the octagon.Especially if they practice san shou/san da.Which is a style very similar to kickboxing.And one more thing that jason goy's website is kinda weird,he call himself sensei and is a kung-fu practitioner.Sensei is for japanese martial arts and sifu is for chinese martial arts.

[elbows_and_knees]

when I said some movements are illegal I ddint mean that barred them completely from competing. Im not making excuses, but to compete NOW THAT THERE ARE RULES they would have to modify some techniques. Like Subgrappler said BJJ has some moves they cant use but modified, the same rule could go for Kung Fu guys, they could modify just as easily...

you're absolutely correct... they could. If you understand your styles principles, you can adapt it's techniques. The question there is why don't the do that...

and elbows_and_knees

like I said its no secret they can handle themselves on the ground I know how long they have both been grappling

I'm not talking about handling themselves on the ground though. I'm saying his striking is so effective because he's such a good grappler. His takedown defense is what gives him his ability to remain standing.

[SubGrappler]

hey subgrappller,you are somewhat right on your theories.

1.some kung-fu stlyes do have a little bit of grappling(of course not as much as bjj),and there are more stances than the low crouched stance

They may have some grappling experience, but as was said lopside fights were common place in early MMA. Weight is a great neutralizer of skill. Its been suggested that every 20lbs of weight advantage = one belt level higher. For example, a 160lb white belt fighting a 180 lb white belt is like a 160lb white belt fighting a 160 lbs blue belt

[BLueDevil]

when I said some movements are illegal I ddint mean that barred them completely from competing. Im not making excuses, but to compete NOW THAT THERE ARE RULES they would have to modify some techniques. Like Subgrappler said BJJ has some moves they cant use but modified, the same rule could go for Kung Fu guys, they could modify just as easily...

you're absolutely correct... they could. If you understand your styles principles, you can adapt it's techniques. The question there is why don't the do that...

and elbows_and_knees

like I said its no secret they can handle themselves on the ground I know how long they have both been grappling

I'm not talking about handling themselves on the ground though. I'm saying his striking is so effective because he's such a good grappler. His takedown defense is what gives him his ability to remain standing.

Well, hopefully someday someone will step up and use Kung fu effectively in the octagon...

[JusticeZero]

You can't just pick one, really. Nowadays, if someone tried to go in the ring with just grappling, they'd get schooled no matter how great their submission skills were. And if someone wandered in with the greatest striking background, they'd probably get tipped over fast.

In any case, it's just a question of what works best in a specific tournament setting in the end. If you want to be a great sport-fighter, watch the rules and adjust to whatever the judges think should be valued, be it submissions, flying side kicks, curling up in the fetal position or turning your back on your opponent. I've seen all of them as the "ultimate scoring technique" at various points.

[Goju_boi]

well i think if kung fu were to prosper,I think that san da/san shou would be the best for the ufc