Are Competitions good or bad?

[Armbar]

Do you think that a focus on competition erodes or enhances the self-defense skills found in traditional Karate? How does competition affect your ability to defend your self on the street?

[AnonymousOne]

Do you think that a focus on competition erodes or enhances the self-defense skills found in traditional Karate? How does competition affect your ability to defend your self on the street?

Yes and yes.

Competitions have rules, street fights don't

Many train hard (and this is good) for competition but they are training around a rule system that is limiting.

Personally I have always trained on the basis of street fighting self defence mainly because thats why I started Karate.

I like the idea of fighting with no rules and no limitations. Sadly you cant test yourself under these conditions because someone would get badly hurt.

Right from the beginning competition seemed limited to me even though I was successful at it.

I feel the only benefit maybe the motivation it gives people to train hard, other than that, I think its a very ineffective past time, but hey.. some people love contests... I don't, except for constantly competing against myself and thats the hardest contest of all

[vertigo]

Good question. I don't know if I can answer "does it help my self-defense?", as I really haven't had a lot of tournament experience, nor much freesparing/self defense training.

I definitely find that competitions help my karate (note: I didn't necessarily say self-defense) a lot. You learn a lot about your kata when you perform it 11 times in a row and tear all kinds of blisters in your feet (and yourself too.. it took a little bit more will power that 11th time around ) I also learn a lot going through the kumite divisions in tournaments. Facing a completely new opponent from who-knows-where is a little more unpredictable than facing your buddy from the dojo. You have to be ready for anything and it takes a bit of a different mental approach.

Does that mean that since my karate has improved, my self defense has improved? Probably... as they're connected, albiet losely at my level, where I do not do much work with any manner of free sparring, though I do know a lot of applications.

argh. I lied! I accidentally tricked myself into answering the question.

Just my thoughts ($10 says someone will disagree with me within 5 posts! )

[Armbar]

($10 says someone will disagree with me within 5 posts! )

Do you take Cash, checks, or credit card? lol

I am mixed on this issue. In sparring, it is always good to have variety in your opponents. This is one thing that competition provides in spades. I was recently at a tournament in central Washington, and they had nearly 600 competitors. This variety provides a good base from which to test your skills and see where you need improvement. (i.e. Do I need to move around more so I don’t get caught? Do I need to work on defending kicks/punches? Do I need to become more aggressive? etc….)

However, competition sparring is far removed from a street encounter, as I'm sure most people realize. Competition sparring is based on certain rules that limit the strategies you are able to utilize. This is not so in reality, as I can use any method I feel gives me an advantage. If I train to fit the confines of these rules, I am limiting myself. I might unintentionally be trapped by these rules in a real encounter. Even worse, I might subconsciously assume that my attacker is abiding by these rules also, which would leave me at a huge disadvantage when the attacker uses some other strategy not allowed by the rules, as I would not be prepared.

I guess I see it as a win/lose sort of thing.

[El Diablo]

Try to put gear on and train at 75% with someone you trust. This will help sharpen your skills. Also, it will help with the "feel" of getting hit. Many people get "caught" and then panic. I feel everyone should train with someone you know. Someone that will not beat the crap out you but, will tag you a little if you let your guard down. So find a training partner and have fun. Just be sure to apply what you learn to every situation you run into. A right punch or left kick looks the same whether in comp or on the street. Just practice. It will come naturally when you need it.

[radicalspiegal]

Well i was told that if you ever run into a situation where the confrontation between yourself and someone who knew as much or more then you it becomes a sparring match, but if you are facing someone who is untrained then you are more self defense because then you wont have to anticipate his movements as much because he would let you get closer, or stand a certain way, all to make it easier for you to defend yourself. And he would probably telegraph a hell of a lot more, he would probably even be squared off, but never assume, allways expect. Thats how it was explained to me.

-Bran

[kenttiensankari]

Kumite neve is the same as street fight, but when sparring you understand better what is it like to try to hit opponent that moves and blocks, and ofcourse hits back to you. You can see a big difference between those who often competes, and those who dont.

In kata I dont like competing, kata should not be judged by referees, since kata aint any dance. because of competitions some are even changing techniques in kata to make it look more impressive, and that changes completly the original meaning of kata.

[Skeptic 2004]

I definitely find that competitions help my karate (note: I didn't necessarily say self-defense) a lot

Not to be too critical of you, Vertigo (and it seems like you might have realized this towards the end of your post), but if you're training your karate as a martial art there shouldn't be a distinction between your karate and your self-defense...

(read my definition of "martial art" here: http://www.karateforums.com/viewtopic.php?p=230186&highlight=#230186 )

Kata tournaments seem quasi-valid (depending on how they are run and whether or not these are kata with valid combat application or made-up kata merely for show). While a tournment in general seems to be a quasi-valid exhibition of one's skill and an opportunity to share knowledge, training solely for a tournament is...well...dumb. I won't touch the kumite issue with a ten-foot pole, otherwise I'll just start rambling.

To summarize how I feel, I'm going to steal Shorin Ryuu's signature block:

"In the old days we trained in karate as a martial art, but now they train at it as a gymnastic sport - it must be a martial art at all times!" - Chosin Chibana

[karatekid1975]

Kumite neve is the same as street fight, but when sparring you understand better what is it like to try to hit opponent that moves and blocks, and ofcourse hits back to you. You can see a big difference between those who often competes, and those who dont.

I totally agree. Competing/sparring is great for these reasons. The conditioning, getting used to getting hit, learning to use what you learn against a moving target, ect. But like it was said already, the rules in competition are definitely not the same as self defense. But if you know the difference between the two (like you know that high kicks are great for competitions and low kicks work better in self defense, ect), and train for both, that's cool.

[Jussi Häkkinen]

because of competitions some are even changing techniques in kata to make it look more impressive, and that changes completly the original meaning of kata.

Such as making a certain leg lift in Gojushiho to be a high and slow and making it a "correct" way of the style, instead of lower and faster lift/stomp of an original version of that very kata?