Kung Fu or not

[Hudson]

As far as why people say "Wing Chun" instead of "Kung Fu", it's because Kung Fu doesn't give any clear picture as to the style. Saying Wing Chun would be a way to shorten saying "Wing Chun Kung Fu".

 

You could add "Kung Fu" to the end of any of the styles, such as Hung Gar Kung Fu or Pak Mei Kung Fu, but just saying Hung Gar or Pak Mei would suffice, since they're known to be Kung Fu styles.

[Ali]

ox skin lantern?

 

me?

 

a little 'hard neck' maybe.....

 

No la, not you.

 

I am saying that you are trying to "light up"

 

the ox skin lantern

[dippedappe]

As far as why people say "Wing Chun" instead of "Kung Fu", it's because Kung Fu doesn't give any clear picture as to the style. Saying Wing Chun would be a way to shorten saying "Wing Chun Kung Fu".

 

You could add "Kung Fu" to the end of any of the styles, such as Hung Gar Kung Fu or Pak Mei Kung Fu, but just saying Hung Gar or Pak Mei would suffice, since they're known to be Kung Fu styles.

 

What I meant was this: Why say Wing Chun AND Kung Fu? You cant say that because that will mean that WC isnt KF. Thats the whole point in this post. You cant say this: "here we train tai chi, wushu and kung fu", so why are people doing it anyway.

[Ali]

As far as why people say "Wing Chun" instead of "Kung Fu", it's because Kung Fu doesn't give any clear picture as to the style. Saying Wing Chun would be a way to shorten saying "Wing Chun Kung Fu".

 

You could add "Kung Fu" to the end of any of the styles, such as Hung Gar Kung Fu or Pak Mei Kung Fu, but just saying Hung Gar or Pak Mei would suffice, since they're known to be Kung Fu styles.

 

What I meant was this: Why say Wing Chun AND Kung Fu? You cant say that because that will mean that WC isnt KF. Thats the whole point in this post. You cant say this: "here we train tai chi, wushu and kung fu", so why are people doing it anyway.

 

Because the martial art school holder is so lazy to explain.

 

Thinking the martial art school is a restaurant

 

(I hate to say that they were Mcdojo even most of them are)

 

Chinese Kung Fu, to non-Chinese, the traditional form like Hung Gar, Shaolin is something like that.

 

Wushu, to non-Chinese, is sometime usually including long fist and some

 

northern fist.

 

The point is for example, a Wing Chun school just teach Wing Chun.

 

But later some other school called their school ABC Kung Fu school and other called themselves DEF Wushu school.

 

That Wing Chun school want to survive in the market, he added in

 

Kung Fu and Wushu just to compete.

 

And say we teach Wing Chun, Kung Fu and Wushu

 

He knows the difference but he dont really care as long as some customers come. I dont need them to know this clear.

 

Pay me the tuition fee and cut the crap, OK

 

Just if I open a restaurant, I orginally just sold hotdog.

 

Later, I said I sold Hotdog, bread and burger.

 

You would say Hotdog is also a kind of bread.

 

I dont care, eat the hotdog, OK

[kzshin]

haha, Ali explained it pretty well.

 

I also remeber there are some chinese martial art schools called themselves "kung fun karate school" cuz back in the days, people not sure what's kung fu, so they put karate in it, so they know it's some kinda of Oriental Martial arts.

[nanfeishen]

agree with Ali , i do.

 

(firstly), I do Kung Fu, or I do Karate, is like saying i drive a car, what is the make , model , colour , year etc etc.

 

(second), most schools offering Chinese Martial Arts, will , or should seperate their styles into (a) "hard" styles and (b)"soft" styles, or "external styles" and "internal styles". Some schools may take it a step further, and seperate the "hard" styles into Northern styles and Southern styles.Example: Wah Lum (Northern Mantis), Chang Chuan(Long Boxing), Northern styles, Wing Chun(Beautiful Springtime) Chut Tsing Tong Long(Seven Star Praying Mantis),Southern Styles, yet all 4 collectively would be classed as "hard" style or "external styles". ....TaiChiChuan, Bagua, and Hsing I would be classed as "soft" styles or "internal styles".

 

Either I clarified the subject , or muddied it further, lets see!.

[fangshi]

I do agree with alot of what has been said above but for a non-technical explaination of the terms and how they are used ( although not correct they are used with consistancy ) .

 

Kungfu - Typically used to describe northern styles of CMA . Mostly the shoulin and long fist forms as well as some newer versions of CMA . Characterized by high kicks . Can have various phylisophical levels attached.

 

Gungfu - Typically used to describe southern styles of CMA . Mostly versions of shoulin and what has derived from them. Characterized by the lower kicks. Can have various levels phylosiphy , not as much in North America & Europe.

 

Wushu - Typically used to describe the sporting aspect of CMA . Taught in the education system as well as in seperate martial art schools. Alot the way Judo is in Japan . Ussually these styles have been taken from various other CMA . Ussually the techniques that are more stylish and do well in competition. Characterized by beautiful flashy movements . Very grand and sometimes over done . Very entertaining with lots of competitive aspects. Ussually very little use of phylosophy , Although some do.

 

The toaist martial arts typically fall in a different catagory as their focus and execution are very different . Ussually just called the art without any other descriptive word being tagged on to the end. For the most part the style is characterized by it's phylosophy . Some more than others , in some schools the health aspect has replaced some or all of the religous aspects of the arts but that has more to do with the teacher than the tradition .

[ovine king]

i hate it when people seem to make things up.

 

here we have two chinese guys telling you exactly WHY things are the way they are and people still seem intent on posting what they think are the reasons.

 

chinese people do not tend to catagorise hard/soft. sure, arts are known to be hard or soft or both but it is not a way used to group or separate styles (unless you are reading old fantasy stories)

 

kung fu=gung fu. no difference. it WOULDN'T be used for northern styles because the term is a cantonese one, a language which is not used in northern china.

 

if you want to bring in shaolin and long fist. shaolin kung fu is normally used to describe ALL shaolin arts. shaolin kuen would be used to specifically refer to the hand/fighting arts. long fist is ONLY known as long fist.

 

cheung kuen=long fist.

 

this is a term which has an expanded meaning of something like 'fist art/form which is long like the river'. you never say cheung kuen kung fu.

 

the correct name for 'tai chi' is 'tai chi chaun'. in the chinese the meaning is 'tai chi hand fighting art/style'.

 

bagua is known as 'bagua jeung' ('bagua palm fighting art/style')

 

'hsing yi',as far as i know doesn't use a suffix although 'hsing yi kuen' sounds right to me....

 

the thing with the names is that they are just names. wing chun can be called wing chun kuen or wing chun kung fu or just wing chun. it doesn't make a difference. this is purely a language thing, that's why there is confusion; YOU DON'T KNOW THE LANGUAGE.

 

actually ali, i wouldn't say 'hotdog, bread, burger'.

 

i think it makes more sense to say 'hotdog, food, burger'.

 

anyway.

 

see, that's the real reason why the chinese shouldn't have taught western guys. they ask too many stupid questions and we have to explain to them things about a language that they don't know/understand and it doesn't matter anyway.

[fangshi]

i hate it when people seem to make things up.

 

.

Certainly I meant no offence to you and had no intention of causing anger in any way . As I stated my post was non technical and I was basing my post on the consistancy of the way the tems are used in north america and the few european cities I have visited .

 

Walking down the streets of any of the cities Of the above mentioned countries Schools with The word kungfu in them are different styles then those of the schools with the word gungfu in them . So in that way there is most certainly a difference . Some of the "kungfu " schools that I have seen most certainly have long fist forms within them .

 

Once again I meant no offence to anyone and was not speaking on the technical translations of the chinese language .

[nanfeishen]

The catogories i was speaking of, or addressing, refer to schools offering CMA in the west, generally it is easier to seperate the styles in to hard and soft so that the average westerner, who has a little interest in participating in the CMA, or has done a little research can then make an informed decision about which school to join, and in which system he would like to participate. Obviously the physical requirements would differ from doing say Wing Chun to Tai Chi Chuan, and it ensures that the uninformed, illinformed, or misinformed individual doesnt land up in a system that he/she is not suited to, or is not physically capable of performing. As to the rest of the info i stated, i am only repeating what was told to me by the various teachers, masters, and grandmasters of their arts that i have had the fortune of meeting in China, Hong Kong and here at home. All of them, could and did prove direct lineage to the founders or show lineages that can and have been proven. As to the language, yes many of us westerners dont understand the language that well, plus there is the Mandarin and Cantonese difference, plus which medium of translation, be it Wade Giles or modern Pinyin, this also creates a certain amount of confusion in the translation of certain terms, words and ideas, I certainly concede that fact.

 

By the way i prefer Sci-fi to fantasy as far as reading material is concerned.

 

Sorry for the last, couldnt resist.