speed fighting

[Shorin Ryuu]

I've not much more to add. However, I keep seeing people writing about "bouncy vs. flat-footed". Perhaps its a difference in terminology. However, I'll reiterate once more, there's nothing immobile about "not bouncing." If anything, it has the potential to move quickly without the extraneous motion, if you do it correctly. Just because you aren't bouncing doesn't mean you've suddenly turned to stone.

 

Heck, I'll even relate this to my brief stint in boxing during college. We'd always get these new beginners who would show up and start bouncing in the ring like one of those 50 cent balls you get out of those machines outside of a Pizza Hut. They would just keep bouncing and bouncing. Then they'd simply get hammered. And I don't mean stone-drunk, although the end result often appeared the same. Those of us with more sense still stayed loose without having to look like a a cat on a hot tin roof. For the reasons posted by Skeptic2004 above, bouncing isn't healthy in many ways.

 

To answer the questions of me. I move in and to the side or sometimes don't step at all. Using rotation of foot, hips and/or stance, you can move off-line without having to step and in a manner that doesn't compromise your balance and chuusen. When I do step, I do so with my heel down. I alluded to this earlier, but you can do this quickly and easily by not pushing off the ground as you move. Some of this is what Skeptic2004 is refering to as well. I actually sort of stumbled on this way of walking after I had knee surgery and found it to be faster, more efficient and less demanding and actually used it (and still do) when walking around all the time. Later I made more of a conscious application of it to my martial arts training, with the aid of the aforementioned Arakaki book.

 

But once again, the only reason why me and Skeptic2004 keep homing in on this issue is that we're trying to convey the idea that "not bouncing" is not the same as being "flat-footed". Yes, my feet are flat on the ground (sometimes, at least) and no, I'm not bouncing. However, that doesn't mean I'm vulnerable to what was written here:

I would also like to point out the phrase "so and so got caught flat footed".....wonder why that phrase came about...it must have some meaning?

 

At any rate, I started off by saying I wouldn't say much, but such is the nature of my posts. Suffice it to say, balance in imbalance and imbalance in balance are important concepts here (which have been brought up in other posts as well).

[buddy]

the thing with not bouncing is that if you were to try and attack not bouncing it would be possible to foresee that attack, as it is a sudden movement from stationary. also through bouncing, if you choose forwards and backwards, you could maybe time your attacks to when you are moving forawrds and so mix it with you bouncing so it is harder to see.

 

it is also harder to feign when not bouncing as are moving around slower, there is less muscle tension than when you are active, so your movements should be slower due to less momentum

 

but it also depends on which type of muscle fibres you choosen to hone, fast twitch muscles fibres are better at moving from statinary and other ppl are better at other movements

[Shorin Ryuu]

Is it that much harder to move? Is it easier to predict? Is it harder to feint? Is there more muscle tension?

 

I'm not being confrontational, I'm just asking you to critically answer those questions. As I mentioned in my other posts, I don't push off the ground to move, meaning there is no muscular tension there. When you bounce and wish to change direction, it requires a shift and muscle tension in order to do so as you already have a muscular movement in the very act of bouncing.

 

I just found it ironic that you mentioned non-bouncing positions as telegraphing your intent when you move as my position is you telegraph more when you bounce.

 

But this boils down to efficiency. The least amount of movement leads to the least amount of possible prediction time. The only way bouncing can mask intent is through displaying too much movement for the opponent to keep track of (and it isn't effective against a skilled/aware/berserk opponent). There are right ways and wrong ways of "not bouncing", but the right way gives the opponent so little indication of movement and intent that it doesn't matter.

 

It also boils down to the basis of everyone's movement. I've said it before, but the way I try to move is to use as little muscle tension as possible and as much biomechanical structure and position as much as possible. That is how I negate your argument both about muscle tension and momentum. As we get older, none of us actually get "faster" beyond a certain point. We just get more efficient. As far as having more momentum by bouncing, that's only if you continue the movement you initiated in your bounce (meaning the fully telegraphed push of the ground). To change direction, you have to push off the ground again and have a perceptible weight shift to transfer yourself. All of which can easily be read.

[brickman]

Some very interesting ideas. I am laughing as I read this because of the vast difference of opinion. Guess the only way to settle it is to meet at high noon with or without hightops on...lol.

 

In all seriousness though.....I find it interesting that the termed "non-bouncy" guys say they have no muscular tension. I always assumed that any movement involved musular tension in some fashion. As in moving from potential to kinetic energy. And the release of muscular tension was the start of kinetic energy. Perhaps we are all just reading too much into what the others are saying.

 

I know who I think are the best fighters I have ever seen.....and none of them bounce and they all hate tournaments as a measure of martial arts, but they all get a kick out of them because they are so funny to watch. But they all move with great efficiency, etc. And yes my sensei does the Naihanchi katas...all three of them.....and says we should all do at least the first one 100 times a day to learn how to move. BUT....he is also the one who taught us how to fight for tournaments......it is soooo much easier to mess someone else up when you get into their timing by bouncing.....IF you can fight that way. I will also add that you also need to be in very good shape to fight that way....It is also my "expert" (and I use that term as a joke) opinion you need to be able to fight both ways.

[1kickKO]

I do fight grounded very occasionaly, mostly on close-in fighters, but with those people (like most) that like to keep a handshake away, it's rabbit time for me. The first time I ever went to a dojo when I sparred very first time ever I was bouncy. Now I"m so used to it, and I try to confuse by making feints, and weird movements...it works for me but I guess to each his own.

[Skeptic 2004]

What, in your (addressed to anyone by the way) opinion, would be the best message to take away from this discussion?

[1kickKO]

Wow this whole topic has changed from helping somebody with his speed-fighting to whether you should be bouncy or grounded..haha what a fun board.

[Shorin Ryuu]

My best message would be something like this: Being in a biomechanically sound position and moving only to the extent needed to get off-line of an opponent's attack with the utmost efficiency is far superior than bouncing, which requires muscle tension to shift direction, thus taking extra time as well as projecting more intent to the opponent.

[mattyj]

Try this... have a heavy bag and close your eyes. Have someone pull the bag back and say NOW or something when they release it. You'll quickly learn to get your kicks up and out fast.

 

lol! thats awesome!

[1kickKO]

hahaha