Kyokushin karate bad points. What are they?

[VinnieDaChin]

okay- let me just ask directly... in tournaments like the one in that video posted earlier, are the guys hitting full force or do they pull their punches and kicks?

[traz]

One of my best friends is a Black belt in Kyokushin, and I"ve been to his tournaments before.

 

Let me tell you..it is full contact. There is no pulling back, it is quite brutal actually. I've seen broken bones, knock outs, and a lot of blood. At the last tournament, there was a guy who had to come in every few fights to mop up the blood.

 

I'm not trying to be overdramatic, and its not like every fight a guy is sent to the hospital. But rest assured, Kyokushin tournaments (at least the ones I've attended) are full-on hard contact.

[Osu No Seichin]

We call them knock down tournaments for a reason. To win cleanly you must either knock out or knockdown your opponent. Fights that are close are also decided by the corner judges and referees. That is to say that if a fight lasts the whole 3 minutes without a clean knock out or clean knock down, the corner judges will then render a decision. So beleive me, no one pulls anything. It is full on.

[uchinadi]

Friends:

 

Kyokushinkai is a very hard school but this hardess is efective with good tanren-geiko, the karateka of this style training very, very hard and your learning is progresive.

 

The Tachi-kata basic is Sanchin-dachi, all your waza are in Sanchin-dachi (as you see is tanren-geiko).

 

All styles of Karate-do have a program, Kyokushinkai is not exception. If anymore style of Karate-do is not have program, so these style is very dangerous in the practice. The Sensei of these style is very important in this vision.

[Dragn]

Having trained in both kyokushin and Muay Thai I have to agree with Vinnie. Kyokushin fighters dont rotate their hips fully.

 

Thai kicks are alot more powerfull.

 

I think their(KK) idea is that if you miss with a fully rotated hip, that you're in a vulnerable position for a counter.Thai fighters do a pretty good job of getting around that problem though.

 

Modern Kyokushin tournies dont do much for me.The lack of head punches and grabbing is just too unrealistic.

 

Its strange, considering Mas Oyama was renowned for his awesome 1 strike kill, that modern KK is so laking in the power dept.

 

I'm not saying it dosen't hurt.It does.But these days its more about pummeling your opponent into submision with fast continuos combinations than taking him out with a powerfull strike.

 

Oyama had a dan rank in Judo too. But modern KK dojos dont train in any thowing or grappling. I guess like so many MA its been watered down

 

to suit competition.

 

Stiil KK fighters are tough as hell and usually can take out challengers from other Karate styles. And Its great for building fighting spirit and stamina.

 

Lately alot of kyokushin schools are breaking off from the main Org and incorporating boxing into their curriccullum and using K1 rules.

 

Its often refered to as shin karate(new karate)

 

Its more kickboxing than Karate though.

[yamesu]

We call them knock down tournaments for a reason. To win cleanly you must either knock out or knockdown your opponent. Fights that are close are also decided by the corner judges and referees. That is to say that if a fight lasts the whole 3 minutes without a clean knock out or clean knock down, the corner judges will then render a decision. So beleive me, no one pulls anything. It is full on.

 

hehe, none of the persons talking about pulling punches and whatnot have ever even seen a Kyokushin tournament for real, let alone ever even contemplate competing in one.

 

the pain is very real, but you never let it show, thats part of the Zen-basis of Kyokushin.

 

ask yourself, if one of those guys punched you in the chest or gut full-force, would you be standing????

 

come to think of it, how many non-kyokushin blackbelts in this forum could possible do a 40man kumite, let alone 50 or 100man. and dish and cop how many blows.............

 

 

As for head punches and Kyokushin tournament fighters, yeah, all of 2inches distance between the top of your sternum and base of your chin, maybe less if you huddle in a guard position like many boxers.

 

 

a good fighter learns to pick their target before they swing a blow. high low or medium, its still targeted with much thought and care. ever had your bare knuckle punch checked by the point of a bare elbow?

 

you learn to pick targets very carefully.

 

OSU

[Sauzin]

Don't get me wrong. I'm not saying Kyokushin is ineffective per se. It's just that you don't get as much bang for your buck. Certainly you get quite a lot of bang out of Kyokushin. However, you have to invest quite a lot more buck to do it, if you get my drift.

 

As usual, this is the whole "tournament environment" versus "street fight" environment debate for me, at least. I certainly don't want to fight a Kyokushin guy in a tournament. If I screw up, I'm sure I'd be seeing stars. However, what Sauzin and I were saying (if I may presume to talk for him), there is less of an emphasis in Kyokushin in general (individual dojo will mitigate this) on the whole range of fighting, which is what we were addressing. We weren't addressing whether or not it would hurt if some Kyokushin guy hit you.

Thanks Shorin-Ryuu. I'm sure in Kyokushin there are people who want different things out of the art. What most of us see are the guys focusing on the tournaments so we do tend to see Kyokushin more from that perspective. However I have read articles that indicate Kyokushin has a good deal of practical street defense, grappling, and ground work. Of course this will vary with the instructor and even the students just like in any style. What I was trying to point out is what traditional Okinawan kata brings to the table in Karate. A lot of the intricacies taught by these very precise and age proven kata seem to be missing or simply not emphasized in what I have seen in Kyokushin. I personally believe that an art is not complete without these things and the end result is as Shorin-Ryu said. You spend a lot more time working to get a similar end result instead of having an art form that emphasizes these small things from the beginning.

 

Frankly in seeing the video linked in this post it shows. There is a serious lack of real power and hip mobility in the techniques. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying they aren't full contact. And I'm not saying bones don't get broken and blood wouldn't be spilt. But you take two thugs off the street and you can get that much. Power is, well, something you just have to see or feel. When real power is introduced into a technique it doesn’t matter if the guy is conditioned or even if there happens to be an arm or hand in the way. True focus and power doesn’t leave something standing after it reaches its target. If power like that were taught in Kyokushin then their tournaments would either be different or a lot less popular. Karate went through this phase, and you should see the gear they came up with to prevent lethal injuries. Broken bones and blood are still common at full contact tournaments in Okinawa even with this gear. Power like this isn't accomplished by just pounding the heck out of people. It is just one thing out of a full and complete range of fighting principles taught and accomplished through kata. And it's all in the little things.

[1kickKO]

Don't know much about kyokushin except that it's full-contact..but that doesn't sound too bad to me.

[pers]

Dear Sauzin ,I really enjoyed reading your post and I totally agree with you .

 

OSS !

[HanSword]

sauzin ,

 

that's right , real power comes from proper technique andbody mechanics. you can't get that from using 100 arm punches on your opponents , even is they get injured .

 

it only takes 1 fully leveraged strike to KO someone, never mind multiple strikes.

 

it's impossible to condition yourself against KO's , if a full powered blow strikes you on the temple , chin etc , you're out . full stop .

 

that's why boxers , MT etc practice evasion , parrying and blocking .