McDojos/McBelts and a perspective...

[Nilla Ice]

Look at McDojos/McBelts this way.

 

EVERY school has students that frankly don't cut the mustard. They try as little as they can, they have problems remembering techniques and forms, they show less respect, etc. What do school owners call these students? BILL PAYERS! These students pay the light bill, the rent, instructor's salaries, etc. If not for these students, the average tuition would be 200 a month EASILY and there'd be fewer options style-wise.

 

I know it's frustrating seeing slackers keep testing and keep promoting and getting the same prize you are working your butt off for, OR ARE THEY? Are they in the shape you are? Are they capable of representing themselves at tournaments with medals? Would they actually remember what they are taught in a self defense situation? Most likely, not. Are they asked to participate in school demos at public schools or festivals? If they are, it's to hold a sign up clipboard for free lessons.

 

Next time you are in class and that same person isn't cutting it, think to yourself..."Thank you for paying the phone bill, slacker!" Turn the negative into a positive!

 

Also, try looking at it from the school owner's perspective. He/she has a lot of bills to pay and rent AIN'T cheap...even if it is cheap. He/she has to keep as many students around, so he/she can continue doing what they love and that's teach you the martial art they love.

[SloMo]

I can understand your point of view but I do not agree that promoting these students, even if they are the bill payers, is the right thing in the long run.

 

I can't image that these schools tell people, well that person is a good ( whatever ) belt but that person pays on time so we keep promoting him. Schools that offer McBelts get themselves into a bad cycle. Eventually all they attract are people who are more interested in a McBelt school because serious students will get frustrated and they are left with nothing but the people who are in it for the image.

 

We have students of different levels of skill. We have some kids that, god bless them, couldn't chew gum and walk at the same time. We do not promote them until they are able to do the requirements we set for that belt level. We have a few kids who have been yellow belts for a long time. But let me tell you. When they do finally test, they are more proud of themselves than any other student there. And it takes time but every student gets better over time and effort.

 

So, while I agree that it is a business and all the rules of running a business apply. I think you can retain your art's integrity and still make a profit.

 

Think of it as owning a car repair shop. You can do shoddy work cheaply and get a lot of customer ( but little repeat business ) or do quality work at a fair price ( or even a premium, depending on the work ). Both routes have a potential to be successful in a business sense. One takes mroe work than the other.

[CloudDragon]

In my opinion, an instructor has alot to look at when considering a student for a promotion.

 

Ability: Is the student performing the techniques to their physical and mental ability? Is it realistic to expect a 300+lb person to do a flying side kick over 4 obstacles? Can you expect a 10 year old to break 3 boards with a reverse punch? Not that these are impossible, but is it realistic for that student?

 

Attitude: Does the student come to class ready to learn or are they there to socialize? Do they respect their seniors, and juniors as well?

 

And one last thing that many people overlook:

 

Contribution: Does the student offer to help other students to their ability? This can be anything from helping to tie a belt to sweeping the floor, to answering questions about when classes are. Some instances the student will have a special talent that can help the school, such as photography.

 

These are not all of the things that must be taken into account, but sometimes when people get promoted in some schools it is done with a holistic approach, the whole person is tested, not just techniques. Does this make for a great technician, IMHO, no, but it does help the person who is striving to be a good martial artist in the sense that a good matial artist must first be a good person.

[Nilla Ice]

I can understand your point of view but I do not agree that promoting these students, even if they are the bill payers, is the right thing in the long run.

 

I can't image that these schools tell people, well that person is a good ( whatever ) belt but that person pays on time so we keep promoting him. Schools that offer McBelts get themselves into a bad cycle. Eventually all they attract are people who are more interested in a McBelt school because serious students will get frustrated and they are left with nothing but the people who are in it for the image.

 

We have students of different levels of skill. We have some kids that, god bless them, couldn't chew gum and walk at the same time. We do not promote them until they are able to do the requirements we set for that belt level. We have a few kids who have been yellow belts for a long time. But let me tell you. When they do finally test, they are more proud of themselves than any other student there. And it takes time but every student gets better over time and effort.

 

So, while I agree that it is a business and all the rules of running a business apply. I think you can retain your art's integrity and still make a profit.

 

Think of it as owning a car repair shop. You can do shoddy work cheaply and get a lot of customer ( but little repeat business ) or do quality work at a fair price ( or even a premium, depending on the work ). Both routes have a potential to be successful in a business sense. One takes mroe work than the other.

 

You miss the point....

[Nilla Ice]

In my opinion, an instructor has alot to look at when considering a student for a promotion.

 

Ability: Is the student performing the techniques to their physical and mental ability? Is it realistic to expect a 300+lb person to do a flying side kick over 4 obstacles? Can you expect a 10 year old to break 3 boards with a reverse punch? Not that these are impossible, but is it realistic for that student?

 

Attitude: Does the student come to class ready to learn or are they there to socialize? Do they respect their seniors, and juniors as well?

 

And one last thing that many people overlook:

 

Contribution: Does the student offer to help other students to their ability? This can be anything from helping to tie a belt to sweeping the floor, to answering questions about when classes are. Some instances the student will have a special talent that can help the school, such as photography.

 

These are not all of the things that must be taken into account, but sometimes when people get promoted in some schools it is done with a holistic approach, the whole person is tested, not just techniques. Does this make for a great technician, IMHO, no, but it does help the person who is striving to be a good martial artist in the sense that a good matial artist must first be a good person.

 

Written like an experienced teacher/school owner. Excellent post. People join from all walks of life, are we to discriminate or embrace who they are and help improve them? The latter is almost always the choice.

[Ottman]

It's been my experience that people who don't really want to learn the martial art they are training in, but rather take classes for image or socialization or whatever, usually quit and move on to other things before making it very high up in rank. In that sense I can sympathize with the bill payer argument. The instructor is (in my case, at my martial arts school) putting in her best effort to teach what she is being paid to teach, but as in every type of schooling, if the student isn't putting in their effort, then it doesn't matter what the instructor does, this student will not make it to black belt, and will quit at whatever level they exhast their potential at. So if they want to continue to train, it's their perogative to pay, and just because you only make it to blue belt, doesn't mean you haven't gained from your experience. Not everyone is black belt material. If they want to pay for an image, or a place to meet their friends, which will consequently lower my tuition costs, I'm cool with that, but that doesn't mean that they will make it to black belt just by paying for it. Not at a real school anyway. The training will eventually catch up with them, and they will lose interest.

 

This doesn't, however, mean that the school is a mcdojo, or that the belts given there are mcbelts. In any true school a rank will reflect the student's dedication to their martial arts, and their own self-improvement. Whether this dedication meets the standards of a certain rank is determined on an individual basis by the instructor in light of what she observes not only on the mat, but in how the student acts as well. Attitude is everything. Most instructors, and any true blackbelts, can recognize who will make it to black belt when the student is at around yellow belt. Those displaying a black-belt attitude are easy to separate from the crowd, and maybe they are afforded more attention from the instructor, but from the instructor's point of view, it's more worth it for them to focus on making great martial artists out of those with the potential to become them, than it is to work twice as hard to try and force it out of someone who doesn't want to put the effort in. I don't think that mcdojos, or mcbelts are what is being described here though, this is just the natural curve of abilities that every school has to draw from. Not everyone can be the best. A mcdojo in comparison is one in which the master isn't doing his/her job by teaching each individual student at his or her pace, to meet his or her abilities and goals. These real mcdojos are the schools that have inflated ranks, since at a real mcdojo, (which coincidentally is what i see happening at many universities and colleges now too) you do only have to pay, and you will advance. With so many black belts coming out of them, interested outsiders think that it must be a good school, so they pay and get their black belts, and it might be chaper for them, but are they really blackbelts?

[Myst]

In my opinion, an instructor has alot to look at when considering a student for a promotion.

 

Ability: Is the student performing the techniques to their physical and mental ability? Is it realistic to expect a 300+lb person to do a flying side kick over 4 obstacles? Can you expect a 10 year old to break 3 boards with a reverse punch? Not that these are impossible, but is it realistic for that student?

 

Attitude: Does the student come to class ready to learn or are they there to socialize? Do they respect their seniors, and juniors as well?

 

And one last thing that many people overlook:

 

Contribution: Does the student offer to help other students to their ability? This can be anything from helping to tie a belt to sweeping the floor, to answering questions about when classes are. Some instances the student will have a special talent that can help the school, such as photography.

 

These are not all of the things that must be taken into account, but sometimes when people get promoted in some schools it is done with a holistic approach, the whole person is tested, not just techniques. Does this make for a great technician, IMHO, no, but it does help the person who is striving to be a good martial artist in the sense that a good matial artist must first be a good person.

I definatley agree with you on that one. My instructor has us bring in a copy of our report card every quater. At testing we are asked to recall our family member's birthdays, our grandmaster has all the kids up for promotion go give their parents a hug, he asks us if we listen to our parents, if we get along with our siblings, etc. Last year, I was even asked if I talked on the phone with boys all the time! I was then told that it was alright some of the time, but not all the time! Anyway, my point is that even if a student meets all the physical requirements (sparring, breaking, patterns, etc.) we still look at their character, and my instructor has held students from promotion because of low grades, lack of respect, etc.

Edited December 24, 2004 by Myst

[Nilla Ice]

It's been my experience that people who don't really want to learn the martial art they are training in, but rather take classes for image or socialization or whatever, usually quit and move on to other things before making it very high up in rank. In that sense I can sympathize with the bill payer argument. The instructor is (in my case, at my martial arts school) putting in her best effort to teach what she is being paid to teach, but as in every type of schooling, if the student isn't putting in their effort, then it doesn't matter what the instructor does, this student will not make it to black belt, and will quit at whatever level they exhast their potential at. So if they want to continue to train, it's their perogative to pay, and just because you only make it to blue belt, doesn't mean you haven't gained from your experience. Not everyone is black belt material. If they want to pay for an image, or a place to meet their friends, which will consequently lower my tuition costs, I'm cool with that, but that doesn't mean that they will make it to black belt just by paying for it. Not at a real school anyway. The training will eventually catch up with them, and they will lose interest.

 

This doesn't, however, mean that the school is a mcdojo, or that the belts given there are mcbelts. In any true school a rank will reflect the student's dedication to their martial arts, and their own self-improvement. Whether this dedication meets the standards of a certain rank is determined on an individual basis by the instructor in light of what she observes not only on the mat, but in how the student acts as well. Attitude is everything. Most instructors, and any true blackbelts, can recognize who will make it to black belt when the student is at around yellow belt. Those displaying a black-belt attitude are easy to separate from the crowd, and maybe they are afforded more attention from the instructor, but from the instructor's point of view, it's more worth it for them to focus on making great martial artists out of those with the potential to become them, than it is to work twice as hard to try and force it out of someone who doesn't want to put the effort in. I don't think that mcdojos, or mcbelts are what is being described here though, this is just the natural curve of abilities that every school has to draw from. Not everyone can be the best. A mcdojo in comparison is one in which the master isn't doing his/her job by teaching each individual student at his or her pace, to meet his or her abilities and goals. These real mcdojos are the schools that have inflated ranks, since at a real mcdojo, (which coincidentally is what i see happening at many universities and colleges now too) you do only have to pay, and you will advance. With so many black belts coming out of them, interested outsiders think that it must be a good school, so they pay and get their black belts, and it might be chaper for them, but are they really blackbelts?

 

Really excellent post and you are right on target with your assessment.

[krzychicano]

It would be just insane to keep a person down because they cannot perform the techniques or forms like you can or someone else can, if the person is giving it their best that is all one can ask for. I agree with the post that most people who slack off and are just in it for the looks drop off before they even reach the advanced ranks. You cannot realistically ask an instructor to turn away a student because they cannot perform to the ability of say his top students. If that was the case then Nilla is right you would be paying some outrageous amount of money to train and what would most likely happen is that the school would close and you would never benefit from that teachers experience and knowledge. This is no longer the times of the buddhist monks...people need to make a living.

[The Saint]

In my experance, some people start MA to achieve a black belt (only a slim percent achieve a black belt at my club). In my opinion a black belt is defined as: Opposite of white, therefore, signifying the maturity and proficiency. It also indicates the wearer's imperviousness to darkness and fear.

 

Most people don't achieve a black belt because it takes a lot of time, work and sweat. Some people want a black belt but don't relize that they have to earn it. If standards are not met by the instructors it should be enforced by the governing body that they teach under. People who strive to be the best and perfect within their art are the people who bring home throphies and metals for National, International and world Events. Belt advancement should be "by the book". Sure everyone is different in skill, but it is a false sense of security to have achieved something that hasn't been earned. I'd bet on a "by the book" green belt over a medioker black belt any day of the week.