Breaks, strains, and tears.

[judoguy]

Does anybody know what bones and/or ligaments are effected during the following joint locks.

 

Heelhook

 

Achilles lock

 

ankle lock

 

calf crush

[judoguy]

Anybody out there? JohnnyS ? Sevenstar? kenpo4life? Treebranch? sano? WHERE ARE YOU???????????????

[Reklats]

Is this really that hard to figure out? I might have the official leg locks coloring book and a package of crayons from denny's around here somewhere that I can send you...

[Reklats]

Ok, since I sounded like a jerk in that last post:

 

Heelhooks can damage stuff in the knee that I don't know about, but I once got decently bad ankle damage from a heel hook. It was to what looks to be labelled the "peroneus longus" in this picture:

 

http://www.orthogastonia.com/patient_ed/images/ankle/ankle_osteoarthritis/ankle_osteoarthritis_anatomy03.jpg

 

because even when it didn't hurt to stand up on, I'd rotate to the outside on that side my ankle would give out and I'd fall over. I found this out in my university's chemistry lab. Glass, chemicals, you name it, it wasn't pretty.

 

The calf crush that I know doesn't target a joint or a tendon or anything, it just squeezes the calf really hard. I only do it in counter to an achilles lock, because it seems like a * pro-wrestler move that just causes pain. I don't know what would happen if I did it really hard. Deep muscle bruises?

[Rich67]

Heelhooks can cause damage to the achilles and other tendons and ligaments in the ankle and possibly the calf. I know that Ken Shamrock busted a guy's ankle applying a heelhook one time, so bones are also susceptible. To a lesser degree, the knee joint can be affected, depending on what position your opponent twists or moves while the hold is applied. Any hold that specifically targets the lower leg can cause knee damage, since the knee is not designed to shift from side to side thanks to the ACL and MCL, and hyperextension is also not its forte. Any of those lower leg holds can create those situations for the knee. I never heard of a "calf crush"...can you enlighten me?

[hobz]

Well, one way of doing the calf crush is to basically take your shin, stick it on the meaty part of their calf, perpendicular to their leg. grab onto their shin on either side of your shin, and pull in and grind.

[judoguy]

Heelhooks can cause damage to the achilles and other tendons and ligaments in the ankle and possibly the calf. I know that Ken Shamrock busted a guy's ankle applying a heelhook one time, so bones are also susceptible. To a lesser degree, the knee joint can be affected, depending on what position your opponent twists or moves while the hold is applied. Any hold that specifically targets the lower leg can cause knee damage, since the knee is not designed to shift from side to side thanks to the ACL and MCL, and hyperextension is also not its forte. Any of those lower leg holds can create those situations for the knee. I never heard of a "calf crush"...can you enlighten me?

 

Excellent post. Thats the reason I asked because I was talking to a guy who swore up and down that heel hooks affect the ankle as well as the knee. I have always thought that it effects the knee exclusively. Oh well, live and learn.

[Kreisi]

if you do the heel hooks the right way it doesn't stress the knee, but if you do it wrong and twist in anyway it can cause pretty bad damage to the knee.

[Gumbi]

Does anybody know what bones and/or ligaments are effected during the following joint locks.

 

Heelhook

 

Achilles lock

 

ankle lock

 

calf crush

 

I'll offer my 2 cents, since I actively train in gi and no gi.

 

Heelhooks have the capability to damage anything up to and including the knee joint from the foot. Heelhooks put much more stress on the knee, and to be honost, a heelhook is a heelhook- what it breaks seems to be a matter of what just happens to be vulnerable in that persons body. Most common injuries from heelhooks target the ACL due to the twisting of the knee. Its entirely possible to break ankles too, but if equal amounts of stress on both on the ligament and bone, I think the knee will be the first to give, since most heelhook injuries are in fact, acl injuries.

 

The ACL and PCL keep the knee from sliding forward to back rather than side to side. If you looked at a knee from the side of someone, the two ligaments criss cross in the middle forming an "X". ACL connects at the top back of the knee and connects to the front bottom of the knee. Together, they keep the knee joint (looking at it from the same angle) from doing:

 

Thigh: __

 

\ /

 

<---X------>

 

Shin: /__\

 

The achilles lock is kinda wierd, as it can be fully applied, but only tear the muscle in your shin from overextending it. Feet may or may not be broken, depending on how the lock is applied.

 

Ankle lock is a vague term, its like saying armlock. The two ankle locks I can think of at the moment are the achilles lock and the figure four toe hold. Toe holds can cause serious sprains in the ankle, or break the foot.

 

Calf crushers and all other muscle slicer/compression locks do exactly that- crush the muscle. I think pain is the most common result, but on a much more serious (and rare I believe) instance, I have heard of muscles becoming detatched on bicep slicers.

[Kreisi]

for example ankle!