dealing with some physics

[pericles]

In my school we have two ippon kumite which are a block/front kick to the groin. the first is a snap kick, the second is almost a front thrust kick. i was told that the goal of the front thrust kick is to break the pubic symphasis (the ligaments holding together the pubic region) causing the hips to cave. I have asked a chiropractor about the practicality of this and he said that it would take quite a bit of force, he's only seen it happen in car accidents and such. Is this a false ideal? Or is this applicable.

[scottnshelly]

i think it's an example of setting one's goals high. it may be possible, but not probable.

 

it wouldn't have the same effect if you instructor said that the goal of the kick was cause a slight discomfort in the opponent.

 

similar to the backfist. your goal is to knock a hole in the opponent's temple, but its not very probable.

[shanemm]

grrrr....physics...the hardest class ever. i got a 73 on my last test and it was the highest in the class...but neways.

 

force=mass*acceleration

 

when dealing with body parts and kicking you add in more factors like density of the foot compared to the groin and visa versa, gravity pulls back on the foot, a lot or air resistance, the fabric takes some of the energy...also muscle can take more of a beating that bone and sinse the groin has a lot of muscle around it I would say that it's unlikely you could kick hard enough to completely break it. maybe severely bruise but not break, muscle is designed to stretch and be abused.

[gcav]

Eventhough you won't get that result, you should kick with that intention.

[DLopez]

In my school we have two ippon kumite which are a block/front kick to the groin. the first is a snap kick, the second is almost a front thrust kick. i was told that the goal of the front thrust kick is to break the pubic symphasis (the ligaments holding together the pubic region) causing the hips to cave. I have asked a chiropractor about the practicality of this and he said that it would take quite a bit of force, he's only seen it happen in car accidents and such. Is this a false ideal? Or is this applicable.

 

Holy Moly!!!

 

I guarantee you kick someone in the groin with not even half the force it would take to physically break something, and you will probably get the "desired result" whether it actually broke something or not.

 

In fact, the person you kicked will probably wish he was dead!

[pericles]

haha yeah i can imagine that anything having even remotely the force required to break the pubic symphasis would be painful enough to get the job done. the theory is that if you break it, no matter how high their pain tolerance is, they won't be able to physically attack you again.

[Sasori_Te]

I doubt very seriously if you could ever penetrate the musculature enough to break this particular suture. It's also very strong on its own accord being that it is fibrous cartilage.

 

Like everyone said it's a nice goal and a good visualization to use during the technique, but I don't think it's very probable.

[TeaL]

haha yeah i can imagine that anything having even remotely the force required to break the pubic symphasis would be painful enough to get the job done. the theory is that if you break it, no matter how high their pain tolerance is, they won't be able to physically attack you again.

People under rate "pain", agree'd you can work through some pain, but after a certin thresh-hold, IE kicking full force into the groin, your body locks down as a natural defense.

 

Want a real example? try breaking a bone, then trying to move it, your body wont likly allow it to move, enough though the tendins/muscles are still there.(not suggesting you do it, but when i broke my wrist, i couldnt move or bend it, even know it was just a buckle.)also a nother good example, snap kick somone in the thigh muscle, about 3/4's up, there knee's will buckle in.... a police officer tought me that once, she said they used there vatons and are trained to hit there for the desired result.

 

The kick, weather crushing or not, will stop the reciever in its tracks. (if it hits of corse.)

 

also imagine how much y0our foot wieghts, maybe 2-3 pounds.

 

multiplay this by the speed its traveling, maybe 50 feet persecond.

 

thats about a 8000 newton blow (estimating), 1 newton = about what it takes to split an apple.

 

Thats a * load of force.

[Shane]

Just Kick them as hard as you can, throw them to the ground and kick them again.

 

Then that night after a few beers tell your friends hey I kicked this guy in the groin and I might have broke his pubic symphasis (the ligaments holding together the pubic region) causing the hips to cave, but I really didnt stop to see if it worked I just threw him to the ground kicked him again, and got the heck out of there.

 

Then when you go to bed that night you can think to youself that it really didnt matter if it broke or not because you tell by the look on his face that it hurt like hell!!!!!

[dear john]

People under rate "pain", agree'd you can work through some pain, but after a certin thresh-hold, IE kicking full force into the groin, your body locks down as a natural defense.

 

Want a real example? try breaking a bone, then trying to move it, your body wont likly allow it to move, enough though the tendins/muscles are still there.(not suggesting you do it, but when i broke my wrist, i couldnt move or bend it, even know it was just a buckle.)also a nother good example, snap kick somone in the thigh muscle, about 3/4's up, there knee's will buckle in.... a police officer tought me that once, she said they used there vatons and are trained to hit there for the desired result.

 

i want to argue that. i was sparring a few months back and i had my wrist broken. i kept on sparring and afterward i even tried to do push ups. my instructor refuses to teach Pain Compliance specificly because of instances like this. when someones adrinaline is high enough, there is very little that they feel.

 

but then again ive never had my pubic symphasis broken.