Whose contributions are greater--West or East?

[Cross_Trainer]

The West has virtually invented modern physical fitness, weight training, plyometrics, and so on. It has also invented boxing (almost an ideal hand art), wrestling, and savate. It has approached MA more 'scientifically' than its eastern counterparts had for centuries--although of course recently they have caught up.

 

On the other hand, the Eastern martial arts read as almost a who's who of MA styles--Muay Thai, Jujitsu, Karate, Tae Kwon Do, Judo, and so on.

 

So, although I realize that both are extremely important and interdependent contributions to the MA world, whose has been greater? Has there been any single nation that has made the greatest contributions? Comments?

[Shorin Ryuu]

Hmm...that's a hard question. Certainly the East came up with the forms, but the U.S. is responsible in large part for spreading it world-wide.

 

My jury is still out on this one.

[Sasori_Te]

First of all, I believe that you are making some incorrect assumptions, but I'll get to that in a moment. I believe that the East still has the greatest influence on martial arts as we are discussing them here in this forum. Now to what I said earlier:

 

1) The Chinese were very clinical and as scientific as the technology allowed them to be in the development of the martial arts as early as 1000 years ago. The Chinese five element theory and the meridian and acupoint theories will back up my argument here.

 

2) The Okinawans as well as the Chinese realized that the better shape you were in the better chance you had of successfully defending yourself. They had devices that were used for weight training and endurance training hundreds of years ago. Look up hojo undo on the internet to see what I'm talking about.

 

3) Every culture has some form of boxing, wrestling and foot fighting in varying degrees. Do some research and you will see this to be true.

[White Warlock]

North

[SevenStar]

1) The Chinese were very clinical and as scientific as the technology allowed them to be in the development of the martial arts as early as 1000 years ago. The Chinese five element theory and the meridian and acupoint theories will back up my argument here.

 

but what has changed since then? CMA today keeps much of the training it used during its inception merely because "the grandmasters did it". Western training methodologies can rule several of these methods inferior and pointless. If I want muscular endurance in my legs, I will run. For strength, do squats. Not an isometric exercise that only builds strength in one position - the one you are holding - which is the nature of an isometric exercise. In order to gain endurance over several ranges, you must hold different positions...stance training. that's really not necessary for a strong base. Some people utilize various stances, such as horse for qigong development - that's fine. But to use it for "strength training" is inferior.

 

2) The Okinawans as well as the Chinese realized that the better shape you were in the better chance you had of successfully defending yourself. They had devices that were used for weight training and endurance training hundreds of years ago. Look up hojo undo on the internet to see what I'm talking about.

 

you are absolutely right. How many of them are still doing that, however? And, for those that do, are they still using similar apparatus and methods, or modern strength training?

[KungFuMan]

The East's contribution has been greater.

 

Even today the real meaning and depth of the oriental martial arts have not been by many so called martial art experts.

 

KFM

[KungFuMan]

That was ".......have not been UNDERSTOOD by many so called martial arts experts".

 

KFM

[HumanTyphoon]

They both are good contributors, because they both did something, and without eachother, MA may have been what it is not today.

 

As someone in the past said, "I could not have done what I did today without a stepping stone." Or something like that....

[SevenStar]

The East's contribution has been greater.

 

Even today the real meaning and depth of the oriental martial arts have not been by many so called martial art experts.

 

KFM

 

1. that doesn't matter... they pay PLENTY of attention to boxing and sport fighting. The contributions there alone have been huge. Also, depth can be overrated...not only that, but may have been added later for no "real" reason. many cma styles back in the day only had one or two forms. the catalogging of forms from various styles have lead to what we have today - some styles with in excess of 30 forms.

 

2. there are as many "experts" in asia as there are here. people in the west tend to romanticize alot of stuff.

 

3. the biggest influence on cma, most people agree, is shaolin. it's speculated that after alexander the great invaded india, some of his soldiers were impress buy various yogi, as they had awesome control over they're minds and bodies. they studied and shared with them, the result being vahjramushti - the art credited with influencing shaolin.

[SevenStar]

They both are good contributors, because they both did something, and without eachother, MA may have been what it is not today.

 

agreed