Karate and Kung Fu

[47MartialMan]

Karate from Kung Fu?

[Shorin Ryuu]

Just some responses...

 

As far as breathing goes, in the Shuri-Te branch of Okinawan karate, all the breathing is natural, nothing is forced, as are the stances. As I mentioned in my earlier post, some of these are even more natural than a lot of kung fu styles (but we've addressed the diversity of these...).

 

Someone mentioned that karate did not connect the body. As someone mentioned in response, good karate is fluid. Modern variants of karate do not connect the body. They rely on muscle to transition in movement and hold in stillness. This is not the same for traditional Okinawan karate.

 

And, as I mentioned before, karate is merely a blend of Okinawan styles and Chinese styles. There are some differences, but you are really barking up the wrong tree when you say that karate is hard, rigid, too linear, etc. Those apply to modern versions of karate. Traditional Okinawan karate is different from these, and is still taught today.

[47MartialMan]

Shorin Ryuu,

 

You study Iaido?

 

Katori-Shinto, Hasegara, Mukai, Yagyu, or Omori?

 

Is it a whole schooling of it and does it belong to a organization, such as Zen Nihon Iaido Remni? (I hoped I had spelled all of this correctly)

 

Does oyur Iaido, have Iaijutsu or Kendo-Kenjutsu practices as well?

[wing chun kuen man]

Shorin Ryuu,

 

Agreed. I went to have a look at local Shorin-ryu class here in Rio on one of my many "research expeditions". The difference between this style and for example Shotokan is very marked.

 

The Shorin-ryu movements seem very fluid and relaxed and sometimes say they have, dare I say a "chinese" feel about them which means that some of the techniques are probably deceptively powerful.

 

Wing Chun Kuen Man

[Shorin Ryuu]

It's a branch of Muso Shinden Ryu. For all that Draeger does not consider it to be koryuu, I see nothing wrong with it.

 

It doesn't belong to a specific organization. I joined it because after a while, you can just tell if an instructor "has it", and this one does.

 

It doesn't have kendo in it (although we do kumite) and at the later levels, tameshi-waza. He says that if students become good enough (he's only been teaching for 5 years, so most students are relatively new), they can progress to steel on steel, but that is obviously a long time from now. He travels to Japan once or twice a year to train with his teacher, Machida Kenshinsai. There is a trip this year, but a bit too expensive (I might go if I can arrange my own lodgings and travel over there...my instructor likes to stay in expensive places). The only thing that bothers me about this is that Van Donk (remember from that ridiculous distance learning thread) claims Machida as one of his instructors, although he only claims he was only given a shodan level.

 

At any rate, as I said, my instructor "has it" so I don't really worry.

[47MartialMan]

Shorin Ryuu,

 

Very interesying.

 

Any links/lineages?

[Shorin Ryuu]

Shorin Ryuu,

 

Agreed. I went to have a look at local Shorin-ryu class here in Rio on one of my many "research expeditions". The difference between this style and for example Shotokan is very marked.

 

The Shorin-ryu movements seem very fluid and relaxed and sometimes say they have, dare I say a "chinese" feel about them which means that some of the techniques are probably deceptively powerful.

 

Wing Chun Kuen Man

 

That's good to hear . Granted, everything won't be a one-for-one similarity, as Okinawans discarded what didn't work for them and took what worked for them. In effect, they saw what techniques worked with Okinawan principles and kept them (most all principles are the same between most effective styles). I have a friend who is taking Pa Kua/Bagua who trained with me for four years in Shorin Ryu. He says the two are extremely similar in many underlying principles and sees how it can enhance his karate training. Likewise, I'm currently reading Cheng Tzu's Thirteen Treatises on Tai Chi Ch'uan and am struck by almost exactly the same wording in explaining concepts and techniques used in the book on Tai Chi and what my Okinawan karate teachers have taught me.

 

 

 

47MartialMan: My instructor doesn't have a website or anything. I did see an article on Machida Kenshinsai in a Japanese sword arts magazine, but I don't remember much of it because it was obviously completely in Japanese and I didn't read too much of it due to time (I had like 2 minutes). It basically said that he is not real famous, but is pretty darn good.

[Infrazael]

Hello board this is my first post.

 

I have many karateka friends & I've noticed some differences between karate & kung fu. The karate forms lack body conection. There are a lot of movements that are just arm swings/strikes. Horse stance is too low & the feet point outward instead of straight forward. Also none of my friends can compare notes on qi gong training. Sparring most kickbox & don't use technique. Of course I'm biased towards kung fu but I believe the individual practioner is more important than the 'style'. Hard quality training goes a long way.

 

Low Horse Stance in Karate??? And you take Hung Gar!!! C'mon dude, we Southern stylists have like some of the lowest stanes in the world. . . . . . .

[striking_cobra]

hey guys, great posting. it's always interesting to find out what people think of the comparisons between two effective martial arts. i won't say one way or the other what is better because as i'm sure you all know it comes down to the dicipline and time that a student puts into practice that makes them effective, not just what art they study.

[Infrazael]

Well, Karate originated from White Crane kung fu I believe, but it has evolved into something completely different from ANY kung fu style, Southern or Northern.