a must read article "why a black belt could be trouble&

[47MartialMan]

The higher the Dan, the more money in hand?

[wing chun kuen man]

The higher the fake dan the more the potential exposure, publicity and ability to attract students (suckers). Yes, more $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$.

 

Wing Chun Kuen Man

[SevenStar]

True. However, that's really know different from the styles (typically CMA) with unverifiable stories, like their styles founder was undefeated in over 300 challenge matches. It all equates to notoriety, which in turn brings more money.

[47MartialMan]

Pink Floyd.................

[Chazsinger]

Tae Kwon Do only reaches up to 9th Dan. I don't know where they came up with 10th dan.

 

Chaz

[Drunken Monkey]

the thing with dan grades is that there is an element of time involved.

 

some of the earliest (founding) masters never lived long enough (after all of their initial training and developing) to 'gain' a high dan grade.

 

as a result, many died having only gained a 4th or 5th dan.

 

today, many people begin training at an early age.

 

even at 18, assuming that it takes 5 years to reach black belt, it would take about 30 years to reach 6th dan.

 

now if the person in question started when they were 18, that would mean that before thay are 50, the would be a 6th dan on the verge of 7th dan.

 

it doesn't quite seem fitting to have a modern student being higher graded than the original masters, which is one reason why the old masters were given with a higher dan grade.

 

but once again, this was an honorary title and not an actual awarded (as in, tested) grade.

[47MartialMan]

Good point,

 

But many masters weren't even concerned with "grade" or years for that matter.

[wing chun kuen man]

Sevenstar,

 

Unfortunately after the years go by it is difficult to validate the notorioraty of some fighters/masters, specially in CMA (Chinese Martial Arts) where the time span can be literally a 1000 years or more. Suffice to say that in the old days china was quite a violent place and any one making big headed claims would very likely face challengers eager to prove him wrong and also traditionally (despite popular belief) kung fu teachers main purpose in life was not to be rich and famous. That is not to say that there were not any fake masters with fake stories to attract suckers.

 

Another point about validating stories is that in even modern times when modern masters and icons such as Mas.Oyama and Bruce Lee (in that order) pass away, five minutes later people appear to say that they were not that good, they were fakes etc. etc. Now they are saying that the bulls that Mas.Oyama killed were drugged or were gay or something like that - by the way I have nothing against gay bulls, to each his own, LOL. They are asking wether Bruce Lee had had real fights etc. etc. No one seems to have tried to validate their stories when they were alive.

 

And all these questions about people who have lived in our lifetimes. Varifying is difficult when people are dead and there is no film record of their deeds. Even written and eyewitness accounts can be disbuted. Best thing to do for doubters is not wait for the person to die before you disbute their fighting abilities and go and tell it to their faces when they are alive and challenge them or something. Many doubters can also made their doubts known to the 10th dans running around in many big western cities like LA, NY, Chicago, Paris London etc.

 

Wing Chun Kuen Man

[47MartialMan]

Wing Chun Kuen Man

 

Good point....

 

Did you know that many Chinese masters were yi sang (yi-shong)?

[Shane]

Good post

 

We must change with the times, I do believe that and change our training to fit the true need.