a little help with horse stance plz

[sAtelitte]

I've been doing shaolin kung fu for 4 months now, i've improved on a lot of things but the one thing which i don't make any progress in is horse stance

 

I have my exam for white sash in two months, it requires i stand in horse stance for 2 minutes, 3 minutes to be safe but as it is (and always has been) i only manage 1 minute After 1 minute it seems i get a bad case of parkinson, start to shake and can't hold it anymore. In horse stance my feet are about 70~80cm apart, and i try to keep the angle in my knees 90degrees but it's usually a bit more.

 

Any advice on this is really welcome

[DLopez]

I'm assuming by "horse stance", what you're talking about is similar or identical to what we call horse-riding stance in Kuk Sool Won?

 

What helped me in my low stances (a Kuk Sool Won trademark) is trying to work on them whether I'm doing basic punching and kicking drills, joint lock techniques, or my forms. Basically, as much as I can.

 

I do use a leg extension press we have at work to strengthen the quads, but that's just a bonus and really, just constantly practicing low stances will get you there.

 

We regularly do stance-specific training and will often hold our horse-riding stance for 3 minutes straight. At first, I couldn't do it without coming up for a brief rest, but eventually, I was able to hold it the entire time. It took me more than 4 months before I was able to hold horse-riding stance that long. It takes much work, so be patient.

[Drunken Monkey]

i take it you are talking about horse as in the one for training,

 

as opposed to the one seen forms...

 

just remember that you can ease much of the 'pressure' by sitting on structure as opposed to relying on muscles.

 

for a start, i'm not sure if you should even be anywhere near 90 degrees (thighs parallel to the ground?)

 

if your thighs are parallel to the ground then taht means you are using your back muscles to keep your back straight (which it should be...)

 

and your feet are not parallel (which they should be...).

 

let's try this again.

 

it might help if i describe how i have always been taught to sit in horse.

 

i) feet are parallel and pointing forward

 

ii) feet are flat on the floor

 

iii) hip is tucked/rolled underneath the spine

 

iv) spine is straight

 

v) the knees are bent naturally (you measure out the distance approx t twice shoulder width or you open four times)

 

vi) you should be sitting on structure

 

vii) you should be mobile (i.e can switch from this to any other stance easily and quickly as well as step)

 

i have seen people do the rediculously low horse stance where they are almost crouching except with their feet further apart.

 

it might hurt like crazy to do this but it is a useless stance because you cannot move from it.

 

remember, just cos it hurts, doesn't mean it's good.

 

some common problems.

 

feet aren't pointing forward.

 

if you 'force' your feet to point forward, you will feel tension on the inside of your thighs.

 

if you then sit higher, this pressure will decrease.

 

there is a point where, if you press your feet into the ground, there will be very little pain.

 

now, at this point, instead of your muscles getting tired cos they are holding you up, you will be getting tired cos you are trying to hold together a 'proper' body structure.

 

you should also be more mobile like this because you aren't working as hard.

 

also, you will probably be sitting higher than you are used to....

 

i can't really go into too much detail as the more i say, the more complex it will seem.

[SevenStar]

different styles do the horse different ways. some, as you, are taught to have a higher horse with the toes forward. I was taught to do a thighs parallel with the toes slightly outward. to be that deep with the toes forward places strain on the knee.

 

satellite, RELAX into it. that's easier said than done, but you really have to get to the point where you are comfortable in that stance. Try this - break out a stopwatch and time yourself - hold your stance for as long as you can - that's your base line. for the next two training sessions, hold horse for that length of time, rest several minutes, then do it again. repeat this 3-4 times. The next training session, try to increase the time. keep this cycle up. Doing this took my horse stance from 1 min to almost 5 when I was doing CMA.

[Drunken Monkey]

i know what you mean.

 

toes pointing forward means you have to sit higher or else have broken ankles....

 

which is why i described how i was taught the 'sit in horse' should be done.

 

i should add taht i have also done the lower, toes outward stance too but this was always taken to be an 'endurance' training thing.

 

my sifu emphasised taht while it is good to be able to sit in for a long time, it shouldn't really be the main way of training it.

 

this is going to sound odd

 

but

 

he kept saying that we should be able to sit in it for a long time, not because we train to sit in it for a long time, but because our stances/stepping/changing of stance/etc should make us strong enough to sit in it for a long time.

 

the difference between sitting to train and sitting to test, i guess,

 

if you see what i mean.

 

hey, i'm curious now,

 

Seven, you've mentioned several time before about your chinese style training.

 

would i be rude to ask what style?

 

(cos um, you seem a bit reluctant to go further most of the time...)

[Ironberg]

The thing that I find helps in this is to hold the horse stance properly - while holding heavy dumbells. Do this for as long as you can in sets - and try this with your other stances.

[tommarker]

A lot of it is mental as well... When you start feeling the shake, try counting backwards from 20 in your head. Seriously.

 

Tell yourself "yes, I know this hurts, and I think my legs are going to buckle, but if I can make it just 20...19...18 more seconds, I'll be happy."

 

The people in class who focus on how much it hurts as opposed to something else (I try to tighten my stomach and make sure my head is held nice and high) are the ones who bow out.

[angelica d]

I agree with DLopez - if you stand in horseriding stance whilst working on your punches/strikes/blocks then you won't concentrate on the pain (as much), and gradually you will get used to it. On the other hand, you could try the really painful way of getting used to it, a way that my instructor made us all do on tuesday. We had to stand in horseriding stance whilst another person sat on our shoulders, for 30 secs at a time with ten second break in between. It carried on for what seemed like ages, but after it was over, just doing the stance on my own seemed like bliss! (OK maybe bliss is an exaggeration!)

[SaiFightsMS]

Practice your stance while doing everyday things like brushing your teeth. The extra time does add up and make a difference.

[White Warlock]

to be that deep with the toes forward places strain on the knee.

I think it's important we emphasize this part. Many people have injured their knees by attempting to practice the horse stance incorrectly.