Ki & Aikido

[thaiboxerken]

Moreover, on an topic he knows little or nothing about and refuses to discuss in a logical manner.

 

You're talking about an immeasurable, supernatural energy that permeates a person's body being real. I'm discussing it as logically as I can. However, without actual evidence of such an energy, we are really only discussing a belief, aren't we?

[aikidokid]

Not at all, I simply have better things to do with my time. However, if you had a million dollars there, I might find a way to challenge my beliefs.

 

If the money you keep on about is so important to you, why don't you take a look at Ki Aikido. You may make yourself a millionaire.

 

You seem to tell me I am a fool for not taking the challenge at the JREF site. Why not investigate, you may become very rich.

Your belief in Ki shows me that you don't know much about ki.

 

Explain that one a bit more.

aikidokid wrote:

 

It is things that are practised on the mat that you would easily be able to see.

 

Such as?

 

I won't bother to give any examples yet, as whatever I describe would only be treated without any thought being given to it. Whatever I say you refuse to consider with an open mind.

[thaiboxerken]

If the money you keep on about is so important to you, why don't you take a look at Ki Aikido. You may make yourself a millionaire.

 

The psychics, witches, mediums and dowsers say the same thing. Why should I consider your claims over theirs?

 

 

Explain that one a bit more.

 

It's obvious that you don't understand that ki is simply a belief or concept and nothing more.

I won't bother to give any examples yet, as whatever I describe would only be treated without any thought being given to it. Whatever I say you refuse to consider with an open mind.

 

So, you won't describe those feats that only a person that can manipulate ki can accomplish, eh? This is even more of a reason not to entertain the claim that ki is real.

[aikidokid]

With you, the glass is always half empty isn't it.

 

Where is your sense of adventure?

So, you won't describe those feats

 

How would you explain that one elderly man could push over over 60 black belt, well coordinated students, lined up in a row, with one hand?

 

Mere strength could not do this, or could you, or is this just another trick you don't want to see.

 

It's hard to have a decent debate on any topic when the other person dismisses everything you say with out even taking time to thing about it.

[thaiboxerken]

How would you explain that one elderly man could push over over 60 black belt, well coordinated students, lined up in a row, with one hand?

 

Body mechanics plus the belief of the students that they will be pushed down. 60 people can not effectively coordinate to actually put their force onto the old guy. The first one or two people are effective, the rest are just getting in each other's way. The first couple of people fall, and the rest fall like a domino effect. It is a trick, although an impressive one.

[aikidokid]

aikidokid wrote:

 

If the money you keep on about is so important to you, why don't you take a look at Ki Aikido. You may make yourself a millionaire.

 

The psychics, witches, mediums and dowsers say the same thing. Why should I consider your claims over theirs?

 

You say I am wrong not to face the challenge, but you back away from this one.

It is a trick, although an impressive one.

 

I was one of these 60+ students and believe me, I wanted to stay there. I was in the first ten and I could not stay there if that $1000,000 was offered to me.

 

You give your explanation to this "trick". Have a go at this at your club using your explanation and let me know how you get on.

[thaiboxerken]

You say I am wrong not to face the challenge, but you back away from this one.

 

Hardly a fair assessment. You already "know" that ki is real. I doubt that it is anything more than a belief, and no amount of trickery will really change my mind. Even if I experience it myself, I would still want some scientific verification for it. I know that experiences can be decieving and that I can be decieved.

I was one of these 60+ students and believe me, I wanted to stay there. I was in the first ten and I could not stay there if that $1000,000 was offered to me.

 

Yes, it's a good trick. A good trick leaves those involved fooled for quite a long time.

You give your explanation to this "trick". Have a go at this at your club using your explanation and let me know how you get on.

 

The trick works regardless of how many individuals are in the pushing "line" of people. It is a matter of bodymechanics and convincing the people pushing that they cannot push the one person down. Beliefs can really work a person over.

 

Have you seen the faith-healers on TV knock people out with a touch? It's the same principle.

[thaiboxerken]

Here is a way you can test that old man to see if he did really use enough force to knock down 60 people. You can simply have him try the same trick on a car, the car can't be fooled or tricked into believing that it will be knocked over.

[thaiboxerken]

http://www.wuweitaichi.com/photo-picnic.php

 

Is the trick anything like to "rooting" and "grand push" tricks shown at this family picnic?

[Shorin Ryuu]

My penchant for plugging books knows no bounds. The Secrets Of Okinawan Karate by Kiyoshi Arakaki really has an interesting look at ki using gravity and certain body mechanics as a basis for interpretation. I really recommend it for those wishing to explore this topic but are repelled by any thoughts of ki associated with a spiritual force. Not that I am judging either way, but I think it is a great read about ki and body mechanics. The first section is about the Okinawan snap punch, but even that part and the rest of the book deal with his concept of "Imaginary Center of Gravity" and ki.