'NEW' Shotokan

[Sho-ju]

I've been in shotokan dojos for 15 years now and have seen a trend within the last 10 years where the shotokan karateka are looking more into the historical aspects of fighting and reintroducing them back into shotokan. I see more traditional bunkai (shorin ryu style bunkai), more joint locks and throws, etc. Has anyone else noticed this? I fully agree with the 'new' shotokan if it can be called that.

[G Money Slick]

I've always loved Shotokan for it's linear simplicity and effectiveness as a defense. New hybrids of Shotokan are always welcomed.

[ESA-Shotokan]

I think it is good that people are questioning so much of how karate is taught now. Since I joined the ESA, I have been learning Shotokan as it was taught by the Funakoshi's and not Nakayama's JKA karate.

 

I have been studying JKA flavoured karate via the KUGB for many years and I now see how flawed it is.

 

My current ESA Shotokan lineage is me=>Alan Armstrong=>Sensei Kase=> Gigo and Gichin Funakoshi.

 

Whereas my KUGB lineage was me=>sensei(s)=>Enoeda=>Nakayama=>Gichin Funakoshi

 

The ESA lineage is more pure and true to the Shotokan style and it does indeed include a lot of take-downs, throws and the such from the bunkai and application of kata.

 

I heard quote recently that, had Gigo Funakoshi not died young, then Shotokan would not have got to Nakayama and the JKA and God-knows sports-karate would not have arisen as it did. I am quite confident that Gigo Funakoshi would somehow have frowned upon tippy-tappy karate.

 

It would have been so interesting to see how shotokan would have developed across the world under the influence of Gigo. Maybe we are getting a taste of it.

 

[aefibird]

I think that its a good thing that shotokan is returning to its historical roots. Too many people have looked down upon shotokan as okinawan karates poorer, stupider cousin; something to bee seen as a bit of a martial arts curiosity but not a 'traditional' system to be taken seriously. Whilst I dont think that Gichin Funakoshi was the greatest karateka to have ever lived, I'm glad that a lot of shotokan dojos are returning to tradition oyo and bunkai of karate and doing away with the crappy 'tippy tappy karate' (as ESA-Shotokan puts it!) To be honest, I think that some of the older traditional karateka must be spinning in their graves when they see the way that some karate dojos (not just Shotokan ones!) have gone. I agree that sometimes changes are good and can be helpuf to the development of a martial art or a sport or a whatever. However, some of these changes for the so-called better have actualy helped to perpetuate the myth that Shotokan is just watered down Okinawan karate for kids.

 

Now, I know that I have only had limited experience compared to some of you on this forum, but even with my (relative) inexperience I think that a return to the old ways can only be a good thing for the development of Shotokan and karate in general.

 

Sorry for the long post... just my £0.02!!

[equaninimus]

I would be cautious about heaping too much condemnation on Nakayama for the long stances and linear theories of the JKA. Most of those innovations are lilely the doing of Funakoshi Gigo. See Harry Cook and Johns Sell's books, as well as the intereviews with Kase Taiji, Nakayama Masatoshi, Nishiyama Hideteka, Okazaki Teriyuki, and Kanazawa Hirokazu in Jose Fraguas' book.

[ESA-Shotokan]

Oh yes, I know Gigo was the guy who brought in the longer stances of shotokan - in effect, he developed the strength of shotokan compared to Gichin, his dad. I agree with you aefibird, I am not a huge fan of Gichin Funakoshi but Gigo, on the other hand, made it into a better system.

 

As for Nakayama, it was he who invented sports karate and that is the thorn in the side I was referring to.

 

[equaninimus]

Oh yes, I know Gigo was the guy who brought in the longer stances of shotokan - in effect, he developed the strength of shotokan compared to Gichin, his dad. I agree with you aefibird, I am not a huge fan of Gichin Funakoshi but Gigo, on the other hand, made it into a better system.

 

As for Nakayama, it was he who invented sports karate and that is the thorn in the side I was referring to.

 

Again, if you read the literature, Gigo was right up there with the other students in agitating for some sort of competition. Gigo would appear to have been one of several students who participated in dojo "challenges."

[Shorinryu Sensei]

I don't do Shotokan, but have worked at his request, with a local Shotokan shodan locally that was teaching here in the past. He had no knowledge of grappling techniques or defense against weapons, and I helped him a number of times with those.

 

I applaud any system that see's shortcomings in their training and wants to improve it.

[equaninimus]

You...you...you..you shotokan basher you!

 

That is one reason I switched to an Okinawan style.

[Killer Miller]

I didn't realize you were that old ESA? You must have been really lucky to have trained with Funakoshi, Nakayama, and the others!

 

Let's get a little real here now... I think you are definately twisting things a bit now. Most of whom you refer to taught the same thing - in general. Although, I don't know "any" two instructors that taught exactly the same either - except for when everyone mentioned trained directly under Funakoshi and was not teaching at the time. Any person that teaches has a different focus as to what aspects should be taught at lower and higher levels. But when everyone trains long enough, what you learn is primarily the "same" in the end. Unfortunately, less experienced people that didn't stay for the long haul, quit early before learning everything, thus they form opinions and in many cases start putting arts/persons down. This is not fair and shallow minded at the leat - lacking the big picture...

 

- Killer Miller -

Since I joined the ESA, I have been learning Shotokan as it was taught by the Funakoshi's and not Nakayama's JKA karate.