Application of stances in actual combat

[aznkarateboi]

Let's face it, as traditional chinese martial arts practitioners we often use a variety of strange and exotic stances, such as cat stance and bow stance. What is your take on the application of these stances? My personal theory is that fights often start in a high stance, usually more or less in the form of a boxing stance. I believe that stances serve two main purposes. The first use is to use the motions to teach how to generate power. The rooted stances and exaggerated motions are excellent for this. I also believe that the stances are used as transitions between attacks as well as platforms for launching powerful attacks. For example, in response to a punch you could use a floating upper block and shift into a bow stance while you counter attack. The stance would help your attack get the full benefit of hip rotation as well as power generated from the leg. After striking, you could return to the bow stance. If this sounds ridiculous, please understand that I am simply trying to find a use for stances outside of leg conditioning. What are your ideas on the uses and applications of traditional stances?

[Drunken Monkey]

i think that

 

i) they are for training in strength in that position; that is the reason for sitting in stances.

 

ii) they are to train mobility;

 

that is why you train moving from stance to stance slowly.

 

the more you do it, the more natural they become and the quicker you can do it and the stronger you are at doing it.

 

it's generally a given that the lower your centre of gravity, the more stable you are.

 

BUT

 

you don't want to be low for too long because it affects your mobility.

 

you go into stances when you need to.

 

(drop into crossed leg so you can spring into bow+arrow or so you can turn out for backfist)

[SevenStar]

stance training doesn't build strength unless you are weak to begin with. Stance training builds endurance, not strength.

 

Having said that, the horse stance has internal properites as well. Whipping power of the spine, qigong, etc.

 

stances are used for mobility, and also can be used as a means to disrupt your opponent's stance.

[wingchunner]

The stances I train in I will use in combat. That was one of the things I really like about the styles I train in... they way we practice is the way we fight. Some of the styles that I had trained in previously I trained one way and sparred a different way. With the styles that I train in there is consistency. I love it.

 

Marty

[JerryLove]

My personal theory is that fights often start in a high stance, usually more or less in the form of a boxing stance.

Obviously fights start in what ever stance the two peope are in at the time.... so I am confused as to your point.

I believe that stances serve two main purposes. The first use is to use the motions to teach how to generate power. The rooted stances and exaggerated motions are excellent for this. I also believe that the stances are used as transitions between attacks as well as platforms for launching powerful attacks.

 

These both seem like reasonable uses for stance training, but they are not the only ones.

it's generally a given that the lower your centre of gravity, the more stable you are.

 

BUT

 

you don't want to be low for too long because it affects your mobility.

 

So? Learn to drop your center of gravity while being upright. It's work but not unaccomplishable

stance training doesn't build strength unless you are weak to begin with. Stance training builds endurance, not strength.

 

That's not true. That's like saying that weightlifting doesn't build strength.

[aznkarateboi]

My personal theory is that fights often start in a high stance, usually more or less in the form of a boxing stance.

Obviously fights start in what ever stance the two peope are in at the time.... so I am confused as to your point.

 

I meant when you are sparring, or when you have more than 1 second to prepare for the fight. Dropping into a boxing stance doesn't take too long

[Drunken Monkey]

well, to keep things simple i was only talking about actual physical aspects.

 

otherwise we open up a whole level of argument that i see would only confuse the matter.

[Sasori_Te]

Have you ever noticed that when you move from a ready position into any stance, the stance tends to move you out of the way of the incoming attack? Stances are transitory movements used to avoid and evade while giving you maximum power to counter.

[SevenStar]

That's not true. That's like saying that weightlifting doesn't build strength.

 

not at all. here's an experiment... find someone who only does stance training. find another who only lifts weights. let them trade exercises.

 

the one who does stance training will not be able to squat anywhere near as much. why? because stance training is an endurance trainer, not a strength trainer. there is no progressive resistance, so your legs merely endure the length of time.

 

now, have the squat guy hold a horse stance. he won't be able to do it as long. why? because he's training for leg strength, not endurance. stance training is not lifting weights by any means.

 

that goes for all body weight exercises. I can bench press 280lbs. a guy that can do 100 pushups but does not lift weights will not be able to. Why? because by doing a pushup, he is only pushing about 80% of his bodyweight, and the resistance never increases...unless he gains weight.

[JerryLove]

not at all. here's an experiment... find someone who only does stance training. find another who only lifts weights. let them trade exercises.

 

That's an entirely different question. There you are asking "which one builds better weightlifting ability, weightlifting or stance training".

 

Your statement was that stance training does not build strength. You need to take someone not doing it, check their strength (squat weight if you like), then have them do it and see if it improves... unless they are already doing some other leg-strength training, it will.

that goes for all body weight exercises. I can bench press 280lbs. a guy that can do 100 pushups but does not lift weights will not be able to. Why? because by doing a pushup, he is only pushing about 80% of his bodyweight, and the resistance never increases...

 

And without increasing resistance, his strength will not go up *as much* as it will with weightlifting. But people who do pushups are stronger than people who sit on the couch... even if the person on the couch is trong enough to do a pushup.

 

Feel a leatherworkers handshake, feel a runner's kick, feel a sewer's finger strength. These come from repetitive muscle use, not severe muscle use.