kotegashiNeo Posted February 26, 2004 Posted February 26, 2004 I self you are quite knowledgeable and I am sure that you are passionate about what you believe but again I will tell you that you are misinformed. The way you explain things so succintly, that if I didn't know better I would assume they are fact. The breathing in sanchin I was actually asking about, I didn't know about the health risks thanks for the advice. It was the remark that goju was a conditioning art and taught to commoners that is laughable and wrong. I am sure you will slam me for disagreeing with your interesting historical views, and when you do ask yourself just what are you trying to prove and to who? I appriciate knowledgable fellows but humility is more important than self rightousness and fortitude. Kisshu fushin oni te hotoke kokoro
I-Self Posted February 27, 2004 Posted February 27, 2004 If you do Okinawan Goju then I'd agree that there is practical applicability, for sure. I know that Miyagi wanted to make his art a budo like Funakoshi did with his Tode. He even wrote about implementing kumite into his karate. He was one of the first sensei to say that his art should go from a brutal killing style to that of a sport that could be enjoyed by all and used to CONDITION Okinawan and Japanese children. Itosu wanted to do the same thing, and he did. Chibana went back to the essence as did Soken Hohan and Chotoku Kyan and the Shimabukurus. The Jundokan went away from the SD aspects of the art as did Meibukan. They are sparring intensive styles. The same for Yamaguchi's Nissei Goju and Peter Urban's American Goju. The art that was taught to the royal palace guards was Sokon Machimura's Shuri Te, not Naha Te. It was different from Naha Te (goju) in many respects and similar in many. The art taught at Shuri was for personal protection (bodyguard stuff) and self-preservation. Goju is like its Shuri cousin, but ask any Okinawan sensei and visit the Meibukan or Jundokan dojo on Okinawa. Then check out Nishihira's dojo, Miyahira's dojo, Nagamine's dojo or Shuguro Nakazato's dojo or any of the Uechi or Sebukan dojos. There is a difference in training and what they concentrate on. I know from experience. It is a good conditioning art. Higaonna's dojo and affiliated dojos are the exception. It's well rounded and concentrates on good kata. He's gone back to the essence. His kata and bunkai are A #1! So I know for sure there is good Goju out there. It can be a very good SD system if taught right, like any karate system. Maybe you belong to one of those schools? That's all. Yes, there is a right and wrong way....There is no "Do" without "Jutsu"!
SevenStar Posted February 27, 2004 Posted February 27, 2004 I self has humility - but truth hurts sometimes, and he's not afraid to tell it...
SevenStar Posted February 27, 2004 Posted February 27, 2004 The truth is the truth hurts. Forgive the arrogance, but I like to tell it like it is. haha, I read this after I typed my previous post.
kotegashiNeo Posted February 28, 2004 Posted February 28, 2004 Laughs conditioning, if you think miyagi conditioned children that is hilarious. Look I will be straight with you a close friend of mine trains with the yagi's several times a year. He told me this story: Everywhere in Okinawa miyagi students were known by appearence.... the appearence of giant welts in shape the of hands from shime conditioning during sanchin. He also never advertised his dojo because he felt teaching goju to just anyone was dangerous because of the lethality of the style. As for shuri te, naha te, and tomari te I am well aware of the okinawan geograpical construct. Miyagi was no commoner however he was wealthly enough to train full time. Now maybe he wasn't royalty like the people of shuri te but wasn't a commoner. I wouldn't disagree with you on the fact that if you trained a shuri dojo then went to tomari dojo that things would be different of course they would. I just think that the wealth of your knowledge lies with shorin ryu which I know very little about and would appriciate any knowledge that you can spare as for goju are you an expert ? Kisshu fushin oni te hotoke kokoro
I-Self Posted March 3, 2004 Posted March 3, 2004 Sev': Thanks bruh'! You gots me blushing! Kote: My knowledge of Okinawan Karate and its history encompasses both Naha Te and Shuri Te as well as Tomari Te. The thing is I have so much to learn, and have never trained in Goju. I have trained and taught in the same dojo as a Higaonna Goju stylist and an Uechi-ka. They were both really good karate-ka. I have been to many AAU tourneys and seen all styles. They all have their merits. Well conditioned Shorin-ka are more sparse than well conditioned Goju-ka, fo' sheez'! You Goju cats are hella tough and pack a mean punch. It's a great art, but I have trained in some form of Shorin since my adolescence, and you're right, I have a lot to learn about Goju. With your background I'm sure you're awesome. Sorry if I seemd to be dissing you. On the contrary I was giving props to the excellent conditioning and hojo undo inherent in Goju Ryu. Okinawan karate is just too dope regardless of region or ryuha! Peace!!! Yes, there is a right and wrong way....There is no "Do" without "Jutsu"!
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