pvwingchun Posted December 15, 2003 Posted December 15, 2003 (edited) I know there is no such thing as a complete art, every art has weaknesses somewhere but on the other hand the art you train can be as complete as you want. Every third Thursday where I train and teach is ground fighting nite. We train against the takedown and what to do if it happens. We use and incorporate the principles of Wing Chun into it. We have a few who have wrestled and trained groundfighting arts so that helps. We have taken a stand up art and practiced it on the ground, of course as long as we maintain principle it can be applied to the ground. We lose none of the stand up and gain on the ground game. Edited December 15, 2003 by pvwingchun Wing Chun Kuen Alliancehttps://www.wing-chun.us
JerryLove Posted December 15, 2003 Posted December 15, 2003 I know there is no such thing as a complete art Then there is neccessairily no such thing as a complete fighter. https://www.clearsilat.com
pvwingchun Posted December 15, 2003 Posted December 15, 2003 What I am saying is every art has weaknesses it is up to you to work on those weaknesses. It is up to you the practitioner to practice your chosen art at all ranges and adapt to those weaknesses, find the answers within your choosen art, in many cases there is no need to go outside of your art. Unless you do that then no you are not a complete fighter, if there is such a thing. Wing Chun Kuen Alliancehttps://www.wing-chun.us
Treebranch Posted December 15, 2003 Posted December 15, 2003 Some are more complete than others. I probably will never know everything there is to know about Budo Taijutsu, but I think there are some MA's that you can master in 5 years of relentless hard training. "It is easier to find men who will volunteer to die, than to find those who are willing to endure pain with patience.""Lock em out or Knock em out"
pvwingchun Posted December 15, 2003 Posted December 15, 2003 Some are more complete than others.Definitely. Wing Chun Kuen Alliancehttps://www.wing-chun.us
Drunken Monkey Posted December 16, 2003 Posted December 16, 2003 but what do you deem neccessary for the art to be complete? how about things other than fighting? how about making sure every (advanced?) student is able to teach? isn't that neccessary for an 'art' to be complete? another little question that came to mind. does having 'more' mean being more complete? is a style that has grappling more complete compared to a style that doesn't or perhaps doesn't need to do grappling? hmmm, dammit, who keeps making me think of these things? my life used to be so simple... post count is directly related to how much free time you have, not how intelligent you are."When you have to kill a man it costs nothing to be polite."
Treebranch Posted December 16, 2003 Posted December 16, 2003 I think any MA that covers a lot of ground is more complete than say an MA that just focus on striking. I think a complete art covers UNARMED techniques which include striking, grappling, ground fighting, ukemi, multiple attacker scenarios, terrain scenarios, weather scenarios, training in the dark and weapons evasion/disarms. WEAPONS techniques cover, knife, bo, jo, hanbo, baton, sword, chained weapons, throwing weapons, firearms, etc.. Also teaches discipline and respect for the MA's. That to me would be pretty complete. "It is easier to find men who will volunteer to die, than to find those who are willing to endure pain with patience.""Lock em out or Knock em out"
Drunken Monkey Posted December 16, 2003 Posted December 16, 2003 but then, you say 'complete' some might say 'less focused'... sorry. that came out wrong. what i mean is, there's always going to be an argument over this which i'm not too keen on. when anyone talks of a 'complete' art, it really sounds like they are saying 'better' art. you may or may not mean it but that is how it would always sound. anyway. let's see, we have striking (most of your list but no real ground fighting) a little joint lock/throw/control two weapons ('knife' + a really long stick) train to not use our eyes train to use our environment. how's that according to your criteria? post count is directly related to how much free time you have, not how intelligent you are."When you have to kill a man it costs nothing to be polite."
Treebranch Posted December 16, 2003 Posted December 16, 2003 Pretty complete, more complete than others, enough to keep you busy for a long time. I don't think better can be used here at all. Better is a matter of opinion, not fact. Complete or covers more is fair and doesn't really suggest more than that. Well Budo Taijutsu focuses on your Taijutsu or Body Movements. So no matter what we are studying whether it is weapons or grappling the Taijutsu is essentially the same and being practiced over and over. So it is very focused. I can pick up any weapon or object and use it effectively because of my Taijutsu. When ours Taijutsu is perfected everything else is just icing on the cake. "It is easier to find men who will volunteer to die, than to find those who are willing to endure pain with patience.""Lock em out or Knock em out"
Drunken Monkey Posted December 16, 2003 Posted December 16, 2003 hmm, still not too keen on 'complete'. how about 'extensive'? but yeah, that's what i mean. we are learning principles that you apply. some people get too fixated on left/right/punch/kick/etc etc and fail to see the reasons WHY. y'know what i mean? they get too fixed on 'block this hit like this' and forget why they use the move in the first place. post count is directly related to how much free time you have, not how intelligent you are."When you have to kill a man it costs nothing to be polite."
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