Shorinryu Sensei Posted November 12, 2003 Share Posted November 12, 2003 i dont see anything to argue about in these rules, but "using the force that is necessary..." are difficult to apply. what is necessary to break someones arm? To clarify that statement...the force necessary to PROTECT YOURSELF. Clearer? My nightly prayer..."Please, just let me win that PowerBall Jackpot just once. I'll prove to you that it won't change me!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nastia Posted November 12, 2003 Share Posted November 12, 2003 I like your "Natural Law" rules. I think these rules, like any rules have to be applied with common sense though. If a half drunk guy at a bar calls me an a*^%whole, I am not going to jump at him and break his arm. But if I am in a situation where I feel a serious threat to me or my loved ones, it doesn't really matter if it's expressed verbaly or physically, I will do anything to protect myself, skipping #2, 3 and 5. The fight situations are never black and white. You have to use your judgement and gut feeling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reklats Posted November 13, 2003 Share Posted November 13, 2003 2) Why not? Why don't words carry consequences? What if the provocation was "I'm gonna go get my gun and shoot your family"? Think you might react physically then? I'd really have to believe a threat before I went into "kill while I have the advantage" mode. Or it'd have to be someone I really didn't like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerryLove Posted November 13, 2003 Share Posted November 13, 2003 Realize that 1 is a bit sarcastic, and 2 is something I believe politically, but find a bad martial practice. Really, my answer to all of this is covered in 8. If the fight can be avoided / run away from; then do so. If the fight is neccessairy, then make sure you are safe. I would rather err on the side of overkill than find out his friend behand me has a weapon after I attempted reciprocity. https://www.clearsilat.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shotokanwarrior Posted November 13, 2003 Share Posted November 13, 2003 The rules are good but it sounds like a good way to get beat down in the street. One warningis all anyone gets, if someone steps into my personal space that is an attack so I back up once, if i can and let them know to stay back. If not i strike. My daddy always said. if you think someone is going to hit you, hit them first. Where Art ends, nature begins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kai_Hwarang Posted November 13, 2003 Author Share Posted November 13, 2003 Sorry, but I don't find that to make any sense. While I'm not telling you to not listen to your father...these rules apply to most Martial Arts practices. I don't see why you would hit someone just because you believed they were going to hit you...as in like telling you....not throwing the actual punch. Pretty much all of the rules are a balanced situation. Use force necessary to counter their own...not more for their little or little for their more. Most people aren't going to just hit you unless they try to surprise you like coming up from behind. Most people will threaten you with soft physical force (like a push) before going all out. It's provoking...that's usually what occurs. These rules aren't something to think about either. Most things will happen within a few seconds, but these rules can also be applied within that time as well. "One must train the mind before the body...for the mind controls the body..." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PrideampPoise Posted November 13, 2003 Share Posted November 13, 2003 (edited) Maybe consider a #10---use only what force is necessary to stop the aggressor and to protect yourself or others from harm. That pretty much covers it. If someone says they are going to shoot you, and you think they might mean it, do what's necessary to prevent it. If you are attacked and have to skip the escalation points to prevent harm, you skip them. Of course if this happens to you a lot, I'd consider a change of scenery, but that's just me. Other than threats, words from others don't cause you any harm (unless you choose to let them), so there is no force necessary to protect you and others from harm. Just remove yourself from the situation. I know, easier said than done, but its what we should strive for. Edited November 14, 2003 by Pride&Poise Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerryLove Posted November 14, 2003 Share Posted November 14, 2003 I don't see why you would hit someone just because you believed they were going to hit you...as in like telling you....not throwing the actual punch. I'm going to protect myself if I think I'm in danger; and I will use violence to do so if that is what I percieve as my best option. The factor that makes that decision for me may be him swinging, or saying the wrong thing, or getting too close. The reason I have a brain is to tell when it is I need to be fighting.Pretty much all of the rules are a balanced situation. Use force necessary to counter their own...not more for their little or little for their more. A great way to get killed.Other than threats, words from others don't cause you any harm (unless you choose to let them), so there is no force necessary to protect you and others from harm. Just remove yourself from the situation. It baffles me that I continue to see "if he has a knife, then run away if you can" or this post. ALWAYS LEAVE IF YOU CAN!!!! Always! Every time! Regardless of weather you know he's armed, or weather you think you can take him, or most anything else. There are times you cannot leave (no safe exit, need to defend something you can't take with you, etc): don't leave then; but if you've got the escape, take it. https://www.clearsilat.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kai_Hwarang Posted November 14, 2003 Author Share Posted November 14, 2003 I'm just going to ask you, Jerry...so you find it okay to hurst someone excessively even if they are doing little to you? So you believe a broken nose is a good exchange for a push? Death is a good exchange for a punch? -Kai "One must train the mind before the body...for the mind controls the body..." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karatekid1975 Posted November 14, 2003 Share Posted November 14, 2003 I can agree with Kai_Hwarang's post to a certain extent. We do learn most of what was said at my school. I was in a self defense situation before. He attacked first (grabbed me in a headlock). I used just enough force so that the attacker was no longer a threat. I didn't kill him, or anything like that. If he had a weapon, however (I didn't see one anyways), I think I would have done a lot more damage. I also helped a friend that was getting "threatened" by a drunk (he was bartending at the time). The drunk swung at him after he was told to leave. I grabbed his arm in a joint lock and threw him out. So it really depends on the situation. Laurie F Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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