Treebranch Posted November 6, 2003 Posted November 6, 2003 Look the reality is that if you are being attacked by more than one person that really know what they are doing, you will probably need a weapon of some kind to equal the occasion. You don't display the weapon, you keep it hidden and use it if you have to. The other thing is that you can train for multiple attackers and there are certain tactics that are very helpful. Are they fool proof? No, but nothing is. Yes there are MA's that teach this stuff and I've been in that real situation and here to talk about it. You position yourself in the right place and things just happen.As opposed to having a battle plan where you'll do the "deadly leopard eye claw strike" on the first guy, then the "perilous rhino groin stomp" on the next attacker, followed by a "floating swallow cranium plunge" on whoever is foolish enough to oppose you next, without ever having REALLY practiced any of them because they're "too deadly." O.K. now you're just be silly. I don't believe any of this crap so don't think I do. If you believe that you can be effective at moving efficiently on the ground, why is it so hard for you to believe that you can't learn how to move effectively on your feet? Also, with good grappling the locks and holds happen with your body movement, Right? Good grappling isn't a test of your strength. All those locks and holds you are doing come from Jujutsu and some come from Kodokan Judo. The way GJJ people train is more important than the art they teach, which is great. Just know that if you train realistically with most any true Combat MA you will be able to handle yourself in most situations. Let me pose a question to you. If all fights go to the ground and that's where you automatically take the fight, what do you do when there is no ground or not enough space to go to the ground? For example, you are standing on sharp rocks or there is broken glass everywhere, or you are up high where you might fall off and die? What then? Also, if you can't take me down what how are you going to be effective? "It is easier to find men who will volunteer to die, than to find those who are willing to endure pain with patience.""Lock em out or Knock em out"
Reklats Posted November 6, 2003 Posted November 6, 2003 If there are sharp rocks or glass: The result of a takedown by me is much more likely to put HIM on his back and on anything sharp. So if I'm locked in a room so I cant get away to flee to the cushiony grassness of outside and there's sharp rocks and glass and HIV needles and whatnot on the floor, I won't pull guard, I'll take him down and mount him. If I'm up high somewhere where I might fall and die: I'll make sure I never get in a fight on a movie set. If you don't have room to grapple, how do you have room to stand up fight? Finally, EVERYONE can be taken down. Worst case scenario I pull guard and drag him down on top of me.
Treebranch Posted November 6, 2003 Posted November 6, 2003 I don't know bro, I think you're limiting yourself. Remember Kimo and Gracie? If they had been in the environment we are talking about Gracie would have been destroyed. Finally, EVERYONE can be taken down. Worst case scenario I pull guard and drag him down on top of me. So how do you know if someone is hiding a weapon in one of their hands and waiting for you to close the distance so they can gut you? Be very careful of being so over confident about sacrificing yourself to the ground when you don't have to. I have friends that study with the Machados and man they are hard headed bro. My friend weighs 160 and I weigh 230, most of the time I just relax and move and he can't do anything. I'm just playing with him. If I start throwing strike as I move he's done. He says I'm too big for him. "It is easier to find men who will volunteer to die, than to find those who are willing to endure pain with patience.""Lock em out or Knock em out"
JohnnyS Posted November 6, 2003 Posted November 6, 2003 Treebranch, You keep saying "Remember Kimo and Gracie? If they had been in the environment we are talking about Gracie would have been destroyed. " This is not a fact, this is a guess on your part. Royce won the fight, case closed. BTW, what rank is your friend? BJJ - Black Belt under John Will (Machado)Shootfighting - 3rd Degree Black BeltTKD - Black Belt
Treebranch Posted November 6, 2003 Posted November 6, 2003 He helps instruct, but I'd have to ask him. Gracie won the fight with the rules and starts and stops that don't happen in real life. Yeah, I'm guessing. Come on be honest he would have got rocked by that monster in a real situation. "It is easier to find men who will volunteer to die, than to find those who are willing to endure pain with patience.""Lock em out or Knock em out"
Reklats Posted November 7, 2003 Posted November 7, 2003 Dude, have YOU seen the fight? The rules in the ufc were different then compared to now. If I remember correctly the match went 12 minutes straight before Royce won by armbar. Kimo also had a pretty messed up face from getting punched repeatedly. Does your friend do BJJ?
Venezolano Posted November 7, 2003 Posted November 7, 2003 That's a contradiction, like you say in real life there is no rules and "starts" and "stops" don't happen, well, if they there weren't "starts" and "stops", kimo had have a broken arm.. He helps instruct, but I'd have to ask him. Gracie won the fight with the rules and starts and stops that don't happen in real life. Yeah, I'm guessing. Come on be honest he would have got rocked by that monster in a real situation. Valencia - Venezuela.
Treebranch Posted November 7, 2003 Posted November 7, 2003 I think you are all biased, and it's obvious why. I not saying Gracie didn't do great things. He and his family have produced a great grappling art. The difference is you guys are Gracie fan boy's and I'm not. So I'm trying to see things objectively. I don't care who Kimo or Gracie are personally. I've watched that fight at least 4 to 5 times and in my opinion, I think Kimo could destroy Gracie in a street fight. You can disagree, you have that right. Fact is Gracie couldn't continue after fighting Kimo and Kimo looked like he could easily go again. There was only one thing in my opinion that saved Gracies hide and that thing was Kimo's stupid pony tail. "It is easier to find men who will volunteer to die, than to find those who are willing to endure pain with patience.""Lock em out or Knock em out"
Reklats Posted November 7, 2003 Posted November 7, 2003 Yeah, kimo would've been able to go again easily as long as HIS BROKEN ARM DOESN'T BOTHER HIM. What could Kimo have done in a street fight that he couldn't have done in that ring? If anything the ring was an advantage for him because (other than not actually getting his arm broken) he knew what to expect from Royce ahead of time. Did you notice how scared he was to go to the ground? Also don't forget that Kimo outweighed Royce by like ~70lbs. Do you think they'd let boxers with a weight difference like that go at it?
Treebranch Posted November 7, 2003 Posted November 7, 2003 Dude do you even remember how long it took Gracie to get him in that armbar? Do you think some guy on the street is going to say, "Hey man you weigh less or more than I do so let's not fight?" Anyway you believe what you want and I'll believe what I want. Getting back to the topic at hand. Multiple ground fighting doesn't exit and it is a dumb idea. "It is easier to find men who will volunteer to die, than to find those who are willing to endure pain with patience.""Lock em out or Knock em out"
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