angus88

LOL! Texas used to have a reputation as having some of the hardest hitters and some of the toughest tournaments in the country. I'm sure the hitters are still there, they just stay away from the tournaments! But honestly, tournaments are all about money now. People won't go if they think they might get hurt - thus the highly watered down version of something that used to be pretty cool. So now, unless you think of karate as a sport, as I've said a million times before, tournaments are utterly useless. And yeah, it stinks when someone gets his jaw broken, but I think suing is the wrong way to go. If the alternative is that crappy olympic style sparring with baseball catcher's equipment on, I'd rather risk the broken jaw.

I don't necessarily think it's all that incredible to have a multi-person kumite, but again, I would like to see what's going on before the fight and what kind of fighting is actually happening. But apart from that, the thing I really find incredible is the 20 or 30 individual full-contact 2 minute fights after a 3 hour belt test. I don't mean to sound like a doubting Thomas, but I'd like to see tape on that one!

Actually, I'd say any dojo with any confidence at all in their fight training would take on people from the outside that came in to the school and wanted to fight. The only thing I'll say about the multi-man kumite and similar type claims is, in my experience they are greatly exagerrated. I'm not saying anybody on this board would do such a thing, certainly not on a martial arts message board...

Baltic - to get 1st Kyu you're fighting 30 fights? I know this might be a stupid question, but is that all in one night? If they're full contact 2-minute fights all in one night, plus kata and everything else you might have to do, even if stretched out to two nights - that's impressive indeed.

You can certainly feel the difference between just standing there and doing a side kick vs using a hip rotation or other form of chambering for your leg, which acts as a kind of wind-up before the kick. Of course the hip rotation could also be a fake roundhouse leading to a side kick. Incidentally, and this is directed to "The Animal" - what do you mean by a TKD kick or a Thai kick?

I also think that video should only be used for review, not for instruction. However, even as a review, I think there are still issues that can easily be corrected with the right videotaping style. For instance, if the person who creates the tape will do a voice-over explaining every single move, what the hidden technique is as opposed to what is being shown, explaining exactly what the target is, etc - taking about 30 minutes, with several different angles to explain a 10 minute kata. In other words, leaving nothing to question. Then you could use the tape and not misunderstand something you think you're seeing, or if the change you make goes against the original intention of a specific move, etc. The problem with that is, the intention of kata and keeping some of the moves vague, is so the karate student can make up his own mind what a particular move is, thus making it come alive for him, and therefore portraying that when exercising it. The way of instruction is changing, and with the internet people are learning through alternate sources rather than a traditional karate school. Whether this is bad or not, only time will tell. Generally speaking, the way the integrity of a system is kept up is through one person teaching another the way they were taught. Books, videos, and the internet go along with the idea of taking a little from every source and then coming up with what works best for you. The systems themselves are lacking when a student is compelled to do that. But what if you don't have access to anything other than some clown at the YMCA that attended 2 years of Rex Kwon Do then started teaching his own brand of "realistic mixed fighting American Korean karate?" Or what if you live in BF Wyoming and 100 miles from the nearest karate school? Ah, too many questions.

Sensei Rick - just curious because my terminology is a little different from yours maybe - but what exactly are "one-steps?"

My experience has shown that typically Goju-Ryu schools chamber at the ribs, while TKD schools chamber at the hip. Personally, I like chambering at the ribs because it gets you in the mindset to get your hands up. And if you've ever taught a new student to fight, dropping their hands and lack of controlled breathing are all too common!

PBI, I think you're explaining youself just fine and I agree with you on all of your points. But I think this is an un-arguable discussion. It all depends on how your dojo is set up. Our dojo is simply not set up for people to "zone-out" and give less than 100%. I don't mean that people are screaming at others that don't go all out - as you said, everybody has a bad day once in a while. The structure of our school just doesn't allow for a casual approach. We don't have a set-up where people train at their leisure. Eventually the people that don't care leave one way or another. If you are part of a similar dojo, when people make claims like that, you probably just scratch your head and wonder whey they don't just join a gym. But the thing is, I would argue that most dojos nowadays allow for the casual student. Thus the watering down of the karate school and black belts in general. Most couldn't fight their way out of a paper bag because they couldn't care less to try!

We use the title Sensei for all black belts at our school. Of course when you think about it, I guess all titles are trivial, but I think they can serve a purpose too. Just like bowing, I think you still need something to remind you that you aren't the center of everyone else's universe. The thing is too, martial arts should be taken seriously. I don't know how serious I would be when I started if I called my instructor "Joe" and we had a beer after class and talked about politics. Know what I mean? Titles can serve as a necessary separation between student and instructor.

I like the following quite a bit - 1. Seikichi Toguchi - Okinawan Goju-Ryu and Okinawan Goju-Ryu II 2. Peter Urban - Karate Dojo 3. Tetsuhiro Hokama - History and Traditions of Okinawan Karate

Yeah, toddler te!

I still say you haven't proved this. I don't doubt that all of those people are good fighters, or that they've been in fights outside of sanctioned competition, but it is impossible to say they are the "best fighters in the world." And yes, I guess it is a little like saying "are NFL players the best football players in the world?" The answer is maybe. There is literally no way to make a claim like that. No way. Impossible. What Tommy P said is correct. Someone is always better. You can only say in their chosen medium, one might be considered best on a ranking system or because of a particular fight, but it's very naive to think that makes them without contention, the best "real fighters" in the world, or in your words as well, "the best fighters in hand to hand weaponless combat in the world." You have no way to prove it.

If you're fast and can make contact that looks effective but don't actually make someone's face red, you'll do fine in a tournament! Seriously though, TKD usually has an advantage in tournaments because they're usually TKD tournaments - not to sound old fashioned, but the kata judging at these things are usually a joke. But that's not what you asked. Fighting guys in tournaments is a mixed bag. You have some schools that only emphasize fighting and others that only emphasize kata, and a rare few that emphasize both. On top of those variables, schools that fight will have different backgrounds with their fighters. Some of these guys will be naturally good, some won't. No one is a machine and no one is an absolute replicant of their art. Some guys that take Goju are naturally good at head kicks, which is typically considered a TKD thing. Some guys are really good at punches, even though they take TKD. Blah blah blah. So after taking the long way around it, it depends on what kind of fighter you are as to how you do. Good luck and watch everybody - no matter what their style is.

That's cool. Don't get me wrong though, I like the idea of team work and all that, and I think it's a good idea to have a sense of responsibility when it comes to your dojo and the other students - to a point. I've seen selfish karateka and usually they're obnoxious blowhards that really won't go very far in karate. But the way I see it, you're learning a way to protect yourself - that's essentially what you're doing. Now keeping "team work" in perspective, let's say a guy you've been training with for two years suddenly misses a month of training. Is your training supposed to stop? If your dojo mate doesn't pay his dues one month do you have to make up the difference? See what I mean? It's all a matter of how far you take a concept. And I definitely think if you're ready for a test and do well, but the other guy chokes and doesn't do well enough to pass, you should pass and the other guy should fail. Because the other side to this is, team work can be a crutch for the weak. Why should you be penalized because the other guy's not prepared? But yeah, I know the type that fails people just to see how they cope - that's a very military way of doing things - not necessarily bad either, but it sounds like you're coping pretty well, so I'm sure you'll do fine next time.