Drunken Monkey

well, what you learn also depends on the school because even in one catergory such as karate there are many, many differences. even in the same style there are going to be differences purely because the one teaching might concerntrate on compitions or they might choose to work on forms+applications or they might be very traditional and teach you everything.

but you gotta be careful... the recoil on those things can hurt..

interestingly, there used to be a whole art devoted to putting on shows such as destroying bricks etc etc in china and these guys never claimed to be martial artists... but then in chinese terms, it's still good kung fu

just curious. how do you guys work for your belt? what do you have to do?

well, hate to be a pain cos i can see this turning into a very heated debate (we seem to cross paths regarding this subject a lot). just like to point out: you say that you found a lot and that you missed a lot. not very conclusive. still seems kinda hit and miss. just out of curiosity, what is your martial art history?

um, because you mentioned people from the film industry? by the way, the dude who played miyagi from karate doesn't belong on that list.

read my post. never said i was going to incorporate anything into my training. just wanted to know more about the styles.

hey, so what was the final verdict on this case?

i had the pleasure sitting on a russian train, in the lower class carriage from moscow to a little village called vologda. the journey lasts about 8 hrs and everyone was drinking for the whole journey. even the guards were getting noticably quieter as the journey drew on. interesting trip.

well, actually i think it was something said to him by yip man...

i think that all martial arts are deadly purely on the basis that they were all meant to be. even something as harmless as tai chi is full of nasty bone breaking joint locks and neck snapping motions. others are more direct and just aim to beat you into submission (wing chun) some have simple "one hit" methods (sup juet sau in hung gar) these are of course simple looks at very complex arts. but then it depends on what you mean by deadly. if it is to cause as much as pain as possible then the locks and holds and joint breaks can be quite nasty. if you want quick knock downs then the more direct sparring, no frills arts are the ones. then there's the ones that can kill and pretty much all martial arts can do this.

but remember boys and girls, don't try to use your elbows until you have trained them properly. you can seriously damage yourself if you don't.

well, the most basic interception, block, hit move in wing chun is still kinda cool in it's simplicity: the the straight punch (yat gee chung chui). it can parry, it can block, it can intercept, it can hit, it can trap it can re-direct.... here's a fun game, name the blocking movements in sil nim tao.

wing chun can be daunting, especially after seeing them pound on the dummy and being untouchable during chi sau. the only real advice is to relax and try to treat it like chi sau, let the moves flow, don't resist and let things happen naturally. try to move at your own pace. the faster you go, the more mistakes you are likely to make.

can you tell us more of the none contact qi-gong?

um, wing chun does not come from shaolin. when it was created, the temples were already nothing more than a pile of ash on a mountain. it's development was entirely outside of shaolin. if you look at the history of the art, it was devised to defeat the old shaolin styles which had been taught to the manchurian soldiers. praying mantis on the other hand was created by wong long (who was a shaolin student) and then refined and developed by the monks at shaolin.

haha, imagine a wing chun guy going in for a forms compition and does his sil lim tao... wing chun, we all laugh at it but we all love it.

i've recently come across a jkd seminar (if you must know, the one on the game of death dvd) and noticed that much of the theories of kali/silat are very smilar to wing chun. can anyone who practices either of these tell me more? anything will do, history, training methods, concepts. absolutely anything.

it is different these days. today, we go to a school and pay and expect to get taught. in the past, you would go to a school ask to be accepted and pray and if you are accepted, are expected to learn. it's a very subtle difference but it's an important one. these days if a student doesn't learn much he probably will blame the teacher. in the old days if you didn't learn much it was probably because you were lazy. the old chinese way was that when you join a school, it becomes your family. you actually lived at the school and took part in the running of the school. all of the titles (sifu, sihing etc are family terms). even when you have left the school he is still your sifu and they are still your brothers.

sorry did a big session on. y'know, the bong sau/lap sau drill and all it's variations. after about an hout of this you'll find that in sparring it is suddenly the only movement that you'll do after the initial contact. until you train another technique that is...

well, the wing chun ready stance is NOT a guard. it is simply to get your hands in the best position for defending your self. seeing as you are the one who will move your arm to intercept, you are not likely to stub your fingers. if you look closely, the intercept movements in wing chun are all applied at an angle. even the mun sau for first form is actually applied at an angle despite it going straight forward.

well, the idea of wing chun is that you end up not having to think of what to do. the endless hours of chi sau and free sparring is supposed to force the moves into you completely so that things happen without real thought. think about when you drive along a route that you are extremely familiar with. how many of the actions you perform do you actually remember deciding on. how many "now i'll indicate, slow down, check mirrors, turn wheel, apply throttle, feed steering, change gear...."? after a while you'll find that when you aren't really paying attention is when you are actually most alert and responsive. there are times when a friend might be reaching across my front to get to something and my hand just goes out to intercept. if only that happens during sparring...

was that a response to my post? anyway, i absolutely agree with you. i am a wing chun student and have always been taught chi in terms of body mechanics. certain body structures are just stronger in certain positions. no magic/mystery involved.

but why did you chose tkd in the first place? or even why did you chose to learn a martial art at all? what have you learnt? has it changed you at all?

well, there is no fancy in wing chun. it's boring to look at, you can't even see most of what is happening AND if the guy is good, you can't even feel what is happening the next thing you know, you're on the floor gasping for air... but then wing chun is a new system that tried to remove the flash and concerntrate on the effective. that's why it's so small and compact and simple. that's a key point on kung fu training, the forms that may appear to be fancy are for training, not combat. just because in the form you step forward into a low stance doesn't mean that when you use it on the street you do a carbon copy of it from the form.