NotQuiteDead

http://www.yorkjitsu.org/jitsu/techniques/locks/wrist.html

What? I think you're misunderstanding me. Weaponless said: By saying that he stated that jiu-jitsu techniques don't use the opponents force against them, and it sounded like he thinks aikido is unique in that it doesn't fight force with force. It's not- even in wrestling (a style that is often thought of a contest of strength by people who know nothing about it) you use the opponent's force against him whenever possible. Using the opponent's force against them is found in a lot of styles and doesn't make aikido unique.

I asked weaponless because he seems to think that aikido is the only art that teaches you to go with the opponent's force. It's not.

Can you name a style that emphasises going out of your way to fight force with force?

Again, I've never trained in aikido. Just thought I'd make sure that was clear. The only ground techniques I've seen in aikido were the finishing 'pins' that are done after ikkyo/ikkajo etc. and suwari-waza, which are done when both people are on their knees facing eachother. Are there any aikido techniques for escaping pins commonly seen in other grappling styles?

Wrestlers usually pick up submissions really fast. I've been training in submission wrestling for about a year and a half (off and on, although even when I wasn't attending classes I practiced with a guy who had been training as long as I had) and I wrestled for a couple months, but when I grappled a four-time state champion wrestler I only tapped him once, and he was on top the entire time. He even tapped me a few times using something somewhere between a neck crank and just squeezing my head and jaw as hard as he could. That was only his second or third submission lesson.

If the classes are small then that is a good thing IMO. Big classes mean less time rolling (unless the room is massive and has mats everywhere) and the instructor(s) won't be able to help you out as much.

True, but Maddwraph asked how to avoid the guillotine lol. I only tried that double leg variation once in practice, and one of the coaches got mad at me because he thought it was just a sloppy double leg... I couldn't get it to work very well either so I just stuck with a normal double with the outside trip finish.

One variation of the double leg that I learned in wrestling is what the coach called an "olympic double". Instead of putting your head outside their hip, you put your head on their chest or stomach, wrap your forearms around the backs of their knees, and drive straight into them. You'll probably end up in their full guard but you can avoid the guillotine.

Here's a pic of the twister: http://www.bjj.com.au/images/the_twister/thetwister10.jpg In wrestling, the "guillotine" is used as a pin but Bravo started using it (along with the banana splits) as a submissions. A lot of people think he's some kind of genius but really anyone who has ever wrestled and decided to look for painful moves in wrestling could find those a lot more. http://www.phoenix.k12.ny.us/jcb/sports/wrestling/Here_comes_the_Guillotine.jpg

I could make a demo video of me fighting against 30 people with ak47's but in a fight against more than one person, even if they were unarmed, I'd probably be screwed. Demos don't mean anything. If you want to see how an art is used, watch people who have been training in it spar/grapple/whatever with full resistance.

Of course it's a grappling art, just a very incomplete one. You do know that those are demos, right?

If you want to learn to blend your striking and grappling, mma would be your best bet. Do you want to learn to grapple in a gi? If so, do bjj, judo, or sombo (although they don't use a gi, the kurtka is like it). Do you want to learn to grapple without the gi? Then look for submission wrestling or no-gi bjj. The MMA classes would probably teach you submission wrestling. Try everything out and stick with what you liked best.

Karo doesn't just use judo. Yes he uses a lot of judo in his fights which is nice to see, but it wasn't "judo vs bjj".

I'm guessing he means something like these: http://www.martialartsinternational.co.uk/prod_detail.asp?prod_ID=1996&main_cat=120&page=Search%20results I've never used them so I'm not sure, though. You might also just try wearing socks.

I consider all styles of wrestling martial arts, especially catch wrestling.

I know what he's saying, but he's not giving a reason that you should train primarily in the gi. Yeah, you can use a lot of the stuff from gi grappling without the gi, but you can use everything done in no-gi whether you and your opponent are naked or wearing coats. IMO, no-gi should be your focus if you want to learn to defend yourself, compete in no-gi events, or compete in MMA.

Really? A lot of chokes rely on the gi, as do a lot of guard passes, pins, reversals, etc. So wrestling doesn't count as no-gi? I've never seen anyone train in wrestling without a shirt... we all just wore t-shirts and sweat pants or shorts. It was the same way when I trained in sub grappling/mma. The only time the slipperiness really effects anything is during matches (in mma because people don't usually wear shirts and wrestling because of singlets). Most of your mat time is in training, though. Most of the people in MMA didn't start out training for MMA, either, but with a certain style. I bet in a few years a lot of the top people will be people who started training specifically for MMA.

It depends what you want to get out of your training. If you want to succeed in MMA, submission wrestling, real fights, etc. then go with no-gi. If you want to be good at gi grappling or have a few more options on the street (in the event that your opponent happens to be wearing a very thick, strong article of clothing) then go with gi training. If someone attacks you on "the street" they'll probably be wearing a t-shirt or something. T-shirts etc. usually aren't loose enough for gi chokes and aren't strong enough to be used as handles for throwing or clinching. IMO no-gi is better for self defense because you learn to control a person without relying on additional handles, you just use their body. It works with clothing and without it (I've done no-gi grappling in jeans and a sweatshirt). How is that a reason to train in the gi? Everything you just named can be done easily without the gi.

If you want full contact sparring without punches to the face, why not just watch/compete in kyokushin tournaments?

I think the weight classes go 103, 112, 119, 125, 135, 145, and that's as far as I can remember. I know another is 189 but I don't remember the rest. No clue, but it would probably depend on if you've ever grappled before and how 'natural' it is to you.

I was mainly talking about the roundhouse, but I'm sure you have more mt experience than me (I only got to do it for a few months).

Yes the style of kf I trained in had a lot of wing chun influence because my sifu taught wc as well. I'm not saying it can't work, but a huge part of boxing is slipping or bobbing and weaving off the line of attack and countering from angles. While wing chunners like to get inside, a lot of boxers like to work from the outside.

I've done chain punching before, but if you're just going in a straight line then the boxer will simply box. He'll move to the side and counter.

SevenStar is correct, learn the switch kick. Also, I don't think 'power sides' are that important for kicks because you don't really rely on muscle as much as you do when punching (not that punching is all about arm strength, though), it's all about your hips. I can get about the same amount of power in each leg. Btw, I didn't think most people had a stronger leg on one side, lol. Edit: You might also try learning to use muay thai when you have your weak hand forward, and then switch to how you fought in JKD when you have your power hand forward.