ps1

Clearly tells you what they do and who their demographic is. Some people don't realize that something as minor as photos can detour a perspective student.

They pop up every so often. But usually shut down within a year or two. Too many people don't like getting hurt over and over again. The more professional places know how to train while staying healthy. That's a hugely important point. Especially because most people don't actually want to fight. They just want to train an art that is alive.

I don't think MMA schools "beat the crap out of each other," not anymore than say Boxing, Muay Thai, or Kyokushin styles. Rather, they are learning applications very early on. As for the sensei you described, I agree that it isn't right to withhold valuable self-defense material to those who haven't achieved black belt. Its a disservice to the students. I can say there's certainly a shift toward a more professional type of business. But for the last 20 or so years, many MMA gyms were just guys beating each other up. Most had very little to no actual training in anything. However, as boxing, kickboxing, thai boxing, and BJJ becomes more proliferated, the gyms are becoming much better and more reliable.

Seems like an odd reference. Did you ask him to define gansters. I'm assuming he wasn't referring to the literal meaning, rather some analogy. Possible Interpretations: Bunkai is for "young punks." Bunkai is for "the uninformed." Bunkai is for "old school guys that have been round the block." Bunkai is for Al Capone.

The word "tradition" is the sticking point. To me, a tradition is something that is handed down from one generation to the next as opposed to rejuvenating a practice that has not been done for centuries. I'm probably splitting hairs here, but I hope you can see where I am coming from. K. I get where you're coming from. However, one only has to play the telephone game to realize that information is, inevitably, lost or changed (either purposely or not) when translated from one person to the next. Do that in a room with 100 people and you'll really see it. Over the course of several hundred years, it's probably worse. I realize that these people work very hard and diligently to avoid such degredation of information/knowledge, but it's quite likely that what is practiced today is very different from how it was practiced 400 years ago. This is especially true because it's no longer battle tested. Ryuha develop from one head master to another. After all ryu means stream so it kinda goes with the territory. Actually, most koryu have very detailed densho to back up the practical. The densho are as accurate as many of the medieval manuscripts. In fact the densho is the tradition and the koryu exist to transmit it. It's certainly going to be more authentic than restarting a tradition that hasn't been trained for centuries. There is simply no comparison. K. Psychology tells us it is different. Whether you or I chose to believe that or not is not important. The likelihood of your technique being exactly identical to that of someone from 500 years ago approaches zero. Similar, for sure. But as hard as we try information is always lost. Densho or no. You're certainly correct that having both the Densho along with the unbroken personal transmition of such knowledge is certainly going to make it more "authentic" than trying to rediscover the knowledge after hundreds of years. There's no arguing that you're right about only getting out what you put in. As I said before, I loved studying the art. It was approached as a cultural exchange as well. It was so much more that just fighting. Very interesting and rewarding. In all honesty, I would probably be studying it again today if I had not found Jiu-jitsu. But, for me, jiu-jitsu is the most rewarding art I've ever trained. It would require a life crisis for me to give it up.

The word "tradition" is the sticking point. To me, a tradition is something that is handed down from one generation to the next as opposed to rejuvenating a practice that has not been done for centuries. I'm probably splitting hairs here, but I hope you can see where I am coming from. K. I get where you're coming from. However, one only has to play the telephone game to realize that information is, inevitably, lost or changed (either purposely or not) when translated from one person to the next. Do that in a room with 100 people and you'll really see it. Over the course of several hundred years, it's probably worse. I realize that these people work very hard and diligently to avoid such degredation of information/knowledge, but it's quite likely that what is practiced today is very different from how it was practiced 400 years ago. This is especially true because it's no longer battle tested.

I think it's good to fail someone as part of a larger test. Especially if they're testing for instructor ranking. I don't want anyone representing me/my school/or my art if they don't have the strength of character and will to overcome small adversities like failing a test.

Such sick judo. And he found a way to connect it so perfectly to his jiu-jitsu. DC is a tremendous athlete.

I marked "no" on a technicality. I teach the Heian kata. They offer a great deal to the students. First, they are easier to learn than some of the other forms. This makes them ideal for a beginner. Second, they have plenty of technique and intracacies to work with. I honstly believe someone could work on those 5 kata alone and learn enough karate to master the art. Keep in mind that I'm speaking in terms of practicing the bunkai contained in them as well as oyo and doing so for several years. As part of a project, I filled a full college ruled notebook with all the permutations of bunkai/oyo I could find in just Heian Shodan (Pinan Nidan). EDIT: I should also add that not teaching them isn't necessarily a bad thing either. Kata is always about how it's practicied. Not how many are practiced. So if you chose to teach just a few of the longer kata, say bassai dai and jion for example, you could get just as much value out of that.

I never considered that before. That's a really, really good idea. I can see that solving a lot of problems. This was used with alot of success when I trained karate. No one every complained about it. Even the kids who thought they were "all that" accepted it with no problems. Usually we just let them wear it until we felt they could test at a level near where they were in the past. Helps them save face and you don't have to seem like a bad guy. Win-Win

Yeah. The only major player that didn't roll with me was Royce Gracie. But that was because the seminar host had scheduled an early flight and Royce had to catch a plane only two hours after the seminar ended. Especially in BJJ, where seminars cost hundreds of dollars, rolling is important. Proving your technique is always encouraged. Respectfully, I am a BJJ black belt under Pedro Sauer. It's not rude to ask me, or any other black belt to roll. It's all about how it's done. If I was in the middle of teaching a class and the guy asks, I'd simply say, "during open mat." If he keeps pushing the issue, that borders more on the "challenge match" type of thing. But that wasn't the issue in the scenario presented. I've trained with many world champs and none were ever upset with me for asking for a roll. I've only ever been turned down if there was a good reason (injury, no time, ect..). In my area, we have some MMA schools and I come from a hybrid art. To train with a BJJ black belt, or someone with similar experience in a primarily stand up or weapons system, involves a bit of travel. Going through the trouble of getting there and not having the opportunity to get beat up in their particular area of expertise would be disappointing. To have it happen that way because of a rule against asking would really turn me off. I know what you mean. The only person who ever refused to roll was Royce Gracie. But ath was only because the seminar host had scheduled his flight too soon after the seminar. Basically, he had to run out the door to catch his flight.

Respectfully, I am a BJJ black belt under Pedro Sauer. It's not rude to ask me, or any other black belt to roll. It's all about how it's done. If I was in the middle of teaching a class and the guy asks, I'd simply say, "during open mat." If he keeps pushing the issue, that borders more on the "challenge match" type of thing. But that wasn't the issue in the scenario presented. I've trained with many world champs and none were ever upset with me for asking for a roll. I've only ever been turned down if there was a good reason (injury, no time, ect..).

This has always seemed to be a weird question to me. I've been asked at least 50 times. You should do what you've been doing for the last "x" years. Train. Your instructor would not be putting you up for testing if you were not ready. Here's the simple fact few ever really point out. You'll go into the test. You'll work really hard. You'll receive a new belt. You'll leave the test. You'll know little more than you did the day before the test. The black belt is the culmination of knowledge, skills, and abilities attained over years of training; not a few months/weeks of preparation.

Yeah...Like I said, it was very interesting. It really changed the way I approach my karate as well.

You clearly state that the student approached respectfully. That the question was the "no no." IMO, Asking a senior grade to spar is always a good thing. The senior grade has the right to say no. But asking is not a bad thing.

Sure...there's a reason they're not allowed in MMA. Because they are dangerous. I'm not sure the effectiveness of a good groin kick or eye gouge has ever been called into question.

Yagyu Shinkage-ryu is a Koryu - no doubt about it. It is primarily a sword school (and a fine one at that), but I do not believe they incorporate tonfa. Maybe it was something your group added in? K. That's quite possible. Viol Sensei was an Uchei Deshi, they sent him to learn with many other Ryu. It's possible he was just transmitting as much information as possible. It was not Yagyu specific. He actually used the term Sogo Budo for the class. But Yagyu was his primary training. Here's more information on Viol Sensei: http://www.seishinkan.com/seishin/sskstaff/johnviolshihan01.html

This was one of the reasons I became disenchanted with Karate. Why would it ever be a bad thing for a kyu to ask a dan to spar. As long as it's done politely, of course. The dan should welcome the opportunity to train his/her moves and the kyu certainly has something to learn. We like to walk around and say things like "you learn more from teaching" or "I learn as much from training with white belts as I do black belts." Then, when the opportunity for such learning is upon us, we smash it like a bug on a windshield. What would I have done in the situation?? I would have publicly humiliated the dan rank for thinking his belt color made him somehow more important than the other person. Then, i would have commended the kyu rank for initiative, and the courage to test himself for weakness.

I attended a 1 year training for Yagyu Shinkage Ryu. There was the opportunity to continue training for the chance to earn menkyo certifications. But I was unable to fulfill the time commitments and was not able to continue the training. We did alot of junretsu (permutations) for bo, tanbo, tonfa, kenjutsu, and jujitsu. I found it very fun, but college made it too difficult to continue and the rules for participation were very strict. Not a true Koryu.

Does karate have throws...yes, lots of them. Does karate practice throws, usually only a handful and rarely in a live fashion.

Who has two thumbs and is jealous??? This guy!!

Using your list, I rearranged it to things I see as credible v not credible. I also added a few categories and removed things you said you aren't sure of. As you can see, your "credible" category heavily outweighs the "questionable" category. With that said, I think you'll have more fun and do better overall if you stop worrying about if you are or are not a McDojo and just enjoy what you're doing. Either you like it or you don't. If you don't, go somewhere else. That's my two cents!

Welcome to the forums. As others have suggested, the best thing you can do is talk to the instructor. They may let you keep your grade, they may not. Also, if you contact Patrick, he can fix your user name to say "Jim12."

Ewwww... that's pretty gross. Plus it has nothing to do with tradition or respect. http://www.24fightingchickens.com/2005/09/09/urban-legends-of-karate-belts/

I'd disagree with that. It has a lot of self defense use and skills in it; it is functional in the wild even if it was never designed to excel in the octagon - it's not LESS suited for use in the wild than MMA is in any case.I agree with JusticeZero here. I also tend to disagree with ps1 in that I think MMA, as in the sport-style that is used in various competitions, culminating in the octagon of the UFC, is really becoming its own Martial Arts style. In its early days, it truly was "Mixed" styles. Now, with how its evolved, MMA has an outline to follow, more or less. I think there is a lot of disagreement on my stance here, and that's ok. Change is always slow to take. But, I think it has grown to the point that it has earned its own title. I get what you're saying. But when I call something "a martial art," I mean that it has a specific set of techniques that are largely universal among all that train it. More over, each style has a specific way of doing their techniques. This is what differentiates them from one another. TKD: Side kick, reverse punch, horse stance, front kick ect... Shotokan: Reverse Punch, Elbow strike,round house kick, front stance...ect... BJJ: Armbar, knee on belly, mount, double leg takedown ect... But MMA is simply a set of rules to work within. So there are not universal techniques used. There are some techniques that lend better to the sport than others, for sure. But I've seen TKD schools put up effective local MMA fighters who use somewhat traditional TKD styles of fighting combined with some sprawls. Others use boxing and wrestling to do ground and pound. Others still just do BJJ and work to put the fight on the ground for the submission. Machida uses Shotokan to great effect in the octogon. Silva fights completely different, using Muay THai and some BJJ. Maia primarily uses BJJ. Still others simply use a blend of several different effective moves. My point is that, MMA is not "a martial art." It is a sport that requires the knowledge of martial arts.