Master Jules

......."elasticated".......niiiiiiiiiiiiiiiice.....I like that word.....LOL

Please dont misinterpret my post. I do truly believe that those levels of the art are attainable, and I do believe that there are Chinese masters who have reached those levels, from hundreds and hundreds of years ago, up to the present day. What I dont believe, is that there is anyone ( with maybe very very few exceptions like Patrick Lacy ) outside of these Chinese masters who have attained these levels. George Dillman and his organization arent frauds, but they are nowhere near the skill levels which you mention in your post Sei1234.

Interesting clip....nice excuse about the unaffected athletes though...Ive met his teacher George Dillman at several seminars, and I can honestly tell you that HE did knock me out with a TW 17 (triple warmer 17) shot, but Ive never been affected by any "no touch" knock out attempt.

Thanks for the informative post PL !

My main style is traditional Okinawan Goju Ryu, which has its roots in White Crane kung fu. If you watch the Crane form, you will see elements of almost every Goju kata there is.

Hey Karateka ....welcome to the forum.....theres a lot of people here who can provide you with a vast array of knowledge and many many years of experience....take advantage of that and ask as many questions as you can....again...welcome to the forum and the world of martial arts....train hard !

Exactly right Sasori Te.....Its just a way of saying.... "good job of training and learning up to now...now keep going....and Oh...btw....heres another belt to hold up your pants"

In "Point sparring", they want you to pull the punches so as not to make full contact with your opponent. Same thing can be said for when (as said in an earlier post) a black belt is fighting a color belt.....you wanna make just enough contact to let the underbelt know that he/she was "open", but you dont really wanna hurt your fellow students/training partners.

Rorion....welcome to the forum I started my training at a Kyokushin dojo back in 1973. I stayed there for 3 years, between the ages of 7 and 10. I mainly practice Goju Ryu and Jujitsu now, but taught for a little while at a Kyokushin dojo back in 96. Its a good, hard style, that often produces very hard core fighters. Keep up the good work, and again, welcome to the forum.

I definetely agree with what you are sying in regards to the "daycare" status of many schools, as well as the * you have to deal with as a teacher coming from the "soccer moms"....Its a shame that the American mentality is "Im paying so you work for ME"....Sorry Miss Soccer Mom....not in my dojo !...... The only thing that I disagree with (depending on where you were coming from) is the focus on the study of kata. I do agree that kata is a main focus (or at least should be), but I feel that all to many schools dont focus on the most important aspect of Kata, namely the "true" applications...bunkai, kaisai, and oyo. Literally ANYONE can learn the sequence of any kata, but without the knowledge of the hidden techniques found within the kata, you may as well have a school full of dancers just going through the motions.

Most westerners tend to go much more kumite because of the history of the journey of karate. Briefly...From China to Okinawa, and then from Okinawa to Japan....the Okinawan understood most of what was being translated from Chinese in terms of all of the hidden techniques which are found throughout the katas of the systems they were studying, as well as many of the subtle nuances of these secrets.....techniques which really were not "gotten" by the Japanese....perfect example of this is the "journey" of Goju Ryu. After Yamaguchi "founded" Japanese Goju Ryu, it was because of his sporadic training with Miyagi that he didnt "get" the whole of Goju Ryu, and the languase barrier which also prevented him from "getting" all of the subtle nuances which are found in Traditional Okinawan Goju....essentially Yamaguchi had to "fill in the blanks", so to speak, and in addition to altering the katas from the original, he also added much more kumite, or free sparring because he never learned the real bunkai applications, or the two man forms which accompany the katas, the practice of which traditionally took the place of kumite. Yamaguchi's top student, Peter Urban, then founded USA/Urban Goju Ryu, and the same pattern follwed.....and so on and so on......Much of the reason westerners practice much more Kumite than originally found in Okinawa or China, and even parts of Japan is because of this pattern. Kyokushin, which is Japanese, and founded by Mas Oyama, was kinda the exception. Although Kyokushin has katas, there really are no "high level" hidden techniques in the bunkai application, as compared to Goju Ryu for example, which is rich with Tuite (pressure point) or Shaolin China Na (seizing and grabbing) . Kyokushin focuses on more full contact sparring, rather than any type of bunkai study, or two man forms accompanying the Kyokushin katas, of which there are none. Aside from that answer, the real simple plain old truth is that most westerners typically dont have enough patience to stay with an art...a true art....long enough to learn really "high level" techniques.....the attitude is more like....."Yeah yeah..whatever...when do we get to the fighting part of class ????" They can and often do become good fighters, but very few westerners ever really wind up learning any real advanced high level techniques. I know Im probably gonna get a lot of Flak for that.....so go ahead.....get it off your chest guys.....rip into me....lol

Unfortunately, youre right. All to often , the newcomer will base their decision on the appearance of the school. Does it have a fancy mat, is the facility full of fancy, new equiptment, are the uniforms colorful...ie dragons on the back, etc....that kinda thing. As you mentioned, we both speak from, as do several members of this forum, many years of experience, and those like us know the meaninglessness of such things. I just wish there was a way to have newcomers recognize a great teacher as easily as they can spot a lavishly adorned and equiped school.

I dont care what kind of layoff he may have had....if hes a 4th degree and cant handle someone...anyone...with 3 months training...hes got no business wearing that...or any belt

Kata is the most important aspect of the training. You can spar all you want, and yes, you will become a better fighter for sure. But through the study of kata, you will uncover the hidden techniques that make the system you study. By limiting yourself to just sparring, you limit yourself severely to the amount of techniques that you have in your arsenal.....kata will provide a much larger myriad of techniques for you to draw upon during sparring/fighting

Good job Fish.....keep going