mushin_042

I don't train in wado-kai but i do study wado in the WIKF organization.

Agreed, they certainly havn't been around since the old days promoting the art of karate. Although, i would say that they are pioneers in the "sport" of karate, because they have created a new set of rules and developed new gear for the protection of the athletes. For the record i definetly approve of the use of weight classes and hand gear. Regarding the weightclasses i'm 5' 8" and about 150-155 lbs, in local tournaments (where there usually arn't weight classes) and in open weight rings i've fought people that are 6' 4" and 200+ lbs. Size is not an insurmountable advantage, but it is an advantage none the less. As to the safety gear i've definetly seen a decrease in the number cuts on faces at tournaments since they were introduced, and they don't interfere with my ability to form a fist or grapple so i like them as well. I would agree that they've continued the work started by others, but honestly i could care less who gets credit for the work as long as karate gets into the olympics without turning into TKD or a NASKA style event. Also, i can understand your frustration regarding certain masters of karate not being involved by the organization. For instance i study WIKF wado but if i were to compete in WKF tournaments i would have to perform wado-kai katas. However, i've come to except that large political organizations such as the WKF are always going to be imperfect, and that unfortunately many of the old masters really don't get along very well. But i definetly agree that it would be nice if we could get all the greats together under one organization to promote the art.

Actually a recognized sports International Federation (IF) is the "sole governing body" of the sport as recognized by the IOC. Certainly some thing could happen that would cause the WKF to lose that status but for the moment it does have it, and if karate were to be inducted as an olympic sport tomorow it would be running the show. Also on their website when it says 173 affiliates it is important to distinguish that those are the number of national governing bodies that are affiliated with the WKF, not the number of independent karate organizations affiliated with it. Also, as i understand it the WKF sprang forth from WUKO and for all intents and purposes they are now one and the same (although i admit that i was born in 1984 so alot of the WUKO/ITKF/WKF political intrigue occurred before i would have been old enough to care). Furthermore, the JKA is a style of karate, and as such would not be recognized as an IF by the IOC. As to the friction that occurred between WUKO and the ITKF, i've heard that this was one of the reasons that karate wasn't considered for entry into the olympics earlier, and i for one sincerely hope that inter-style/inter-organizational bickering wont hold the art/sport of karate back in the future in the same manner that it has in the past.

The WKF is the only governing body of karate recognized by the ioc, you can find that on their site here, http://www.olympic.org/uk/organisation/if/fi_uk.asp?id_federation=46 The WKF's site is, http://www.wkf.net/ The governing body for karate in the usa, as recognized by the IOC and the USOC is the USANKF you can find their website at, http://www.usankf.org/ Neither organization is a "Shotokan" organization, the 4 major styles of Japanese karate that these organizations represent are shotokan, wado ryu, goju ryu, and shito ryu. The rules are indeed not full contact you can find a copy of the WKF rules at, http://www.wkf.net/html/karaterules-eng.html If you've never seen a tournament run in this format you can find some videos at the following website, http://richschwinn.com/video/karate/y_frame_index.php

Zakiru, i think we met at nationals, my name is David i was the brown belt from Team Kokoro down in tx. If i'm correct and i'm pretty sure i am, how are you doing lately? Myself i'm doing pretty good, i moved up to the black belt ring for NKF nationals and fought in the -80kg 18-20y.o. division and lost a close fight in the first round, in the -80kg adults ring i lost in the first round to Troy Hirschkorn (i was pretty pleased with this fight because i was the only one of the -80kg juniors to score on him and he nearly beat John) Troy also beat Vince in the second round (i believe you met Vince at AAU year before last), then in the open ring i lost in Encho Sen to a guy named Rocky that Vince knew from the AAU junior team (I think i got lucky on losing that one because Billy Finegan opened a huge cut on his face in the next round). At the moment i'm getting ready for AAU association on saturday and hoping to get my first gold in the BB ring. I've been working out more so i'm comfortably in the -75kg class which should be good for me since i'm not exactly very tall.

DLopez, you can find the rules that karate will use if it's ever in the olympics at http://www.wkf.net/ . The wkf has rules for kata competition but i seriously doubt that kata performance will make it's way into the olympics. They ioc doesn't typically like increasing the number of participants in the games much which is why boxing, and taekwondo are short some weight classes in the games and also why you wont find poomse (korean kata) performances in the games either.

I don't know that it's such a sure shot for 2008 but if karate ever ends up in the olympics it will be definetly be with the wkf's rules. The usa's olympic governing body for karate's website is usankf.org for anyone who is interested there's some cool video from the titan games on there for anyone who wants to see what olympic style karate looks like.

I just got back from aau nationals and was thinking about all the ads i saw for big traditional tournaments. Some of my dojo mates and i are looking to make some road trips to some of the larger traditional tournaments this year and were wondering what's out there. Currently i'm looking at the atlanta cup, the usankf us open, the ozawa cup, and the chicago classic. I've heard of some good sized one's in new york and california but don't really have any information on them. So my question is if you've been to any of the tournaments i've listed what did you think of them, also what other tournaments out there should i be looking at attending.

In most traditional karate schools people fight point sparring because it's a lot safer. In the rules we train under the only gear you're required to wear is a mouthpiece, cup, and hand gear that doesn't do a whole lot to protect your opponent (who remembers the old cloth knuckle protectors). Also everything above the waist is a target except the arms this includes the neck throat kidneys etc. hitting these full contact in these targets with the amount of gear we wear would not be to much fun. Also we allow takedowns so having someone do a takedown and stomp your face into the mat (perfectly legal if you control it) would suck. As for it not being effective i've given 2 people concussions with improperly controlled techniques, my sensei has had his ribs broken (full contact to the body is generally ok with most ref's) also he accidently fractured an opponents skull with a roundhouse kick at a tournament last month and i've seen several broken noses and other similar injuries at tournaments. Can people develop bad habits from points fighting sure, but can people who are used to full contact develop bad habits, sure. Kyokushin guys get used to people not punching them in the face or throat, kickboxers arn't used to having someone grab a kick and throw them on their face. Basicaly i think there are two theories to practicing for fighting some decided it was best to restrict target areas and techniques and use more safety gear and others chose to use less gear more target areas and less contact. Different strokes i suppose...

No thanks i just had something cought in my throat.

I guess our dojo's are the only one's that have rules for fighting. ramy, yeah i definetly like the new rules alot. I used to wrestle in high school so i like to do takedowns anyway but with the possibillity of a sanbon i definetly enjoy the new rules. Also with the increased points for body and head kicks i think people throw them alot more so i have a lot more opportunities to catch a kick and sweep their plant leg.

*cough* Wado Kokusai karate-do renmei *cough*

Your "junk" doesn't have to hit the ground to do a good kick but if you're extremely flexible it makes your jodan kicks faster and easier to perform. If you're flexible enough to not feel any resistance when you kick at another fighters head level it will be alot easier for you to kick them in the head.

I'm not really to knowledgeable about musical demos as it's not something we really do in my style but i always thought it would be funny to do a musical bo kata to 50 cent's "i've got the magic stick"

After reading some of the threads here i was curious about what type of rules you guys use when you spar, and what type of tournaments most people compete in or if you compete in tournaments at all. As for me, in our dojo we generally use the wkf/aau rules and also we generally compete in usankf, aau, our own style's tournaments, and also some smaller tournaments hosted with the same rules. I have competed in some tournaments that used more naska/open tournament type rules but I don't like that type of tournament very much. I hate wearing all that foam gear, all i usually train with is hand gear, a mouthpiece, a cup, and headgear depending on whether i'm sparring in a regular class or one with just brown and black belts. Also though i've done well at those tournaments (placed highest in my division everytime i competed for a full year) i'm used to being able to do take downs and attack to the back and i find that i like the traditional rules better. Funny anecdote, once i competed at one of these open type rules tournaments a few weeks before aau nationals, i was fighting a tang soo do guy in the finals and he threw a kick at my head and i blocked it, he didn't rechamber it so i grabbed his kicking leg, swept his plant leg, and hit him on the ground. In that league doing the sweep and especially attacking a downed opponent were fouls, whoops . When i looked around triumphantly after what in my head was a beautiful ippon/sanbon i saw a lot of tkd people with their jaws dropped, my teamates shouting ippon, and my sensei laughing harder than i've ever seen him laugh at a tournament. I thought i was gonna get dq'ed but i just got warned, and managed to win the fight.